xterra chaos

Posted by: Anonymous

xterra chaos - 26/07/07 03:22 PM

hey e1. i could use a lil advice, i play hard & always breakin something. i have 03 X se/sc w/ 3+2 on 32x11.50x17 ssr, hd steering kit w/ stabl. truck has 25k on it, blew motor at 12k (NOT COVERED BY WARRANTY). they said, it was due to offroad abuse. (xterra = cross terrain) anyways. 2 altern. broke sway way t-bar. driver side warn hub, pass. side lower control has a nice crack through it, and know i have a nasty clicking noise in front axle. think a spider gear cracked, not sure yet. so heres my xroad, sas heard alot about, how about total chaos kit any1 have1????
THANKS 4 UR KNOWLEDGE
GRAFHX
Posted by: Carlton McMillan

Re: xterra chaos - 26/07/07 05:19 PM

Learn to type complete sentences in English.

If you are breaking the IFS, nuking the diffs and blowing up motors now, you will still break things if you do a solid axle swap or other heavy duty lift.

Better parts don't always cure bad driving habits.
Posted by: Kaiser

Re: xterra chaos - 26/07/07 05:58 PM

Sounds like you're doing high speed offroading (as opposed to the <5mph rock crawling that a lot of us do). If that's the case, you don't want a solid axle swap - you want the total chaos longarm IFS kit. It's expensive - but very cool. There's at least one guy on here who has it - maybe he'll speak up.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 26/07/07 06:25 PM

If you need help with the kit you buy.
I can help or people on this site
http://www.midwestxterraowners.com/
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 26/07/07 06:31 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Kaiser:
Sounds like you're doing high speed offroading (as opposed to the <5mph rock crawling that a lot of us do). If that's the case, you don't want a solid axle swap - you want the total chaos longarm IFS kit. It's expensive - but very cool. There's at least one guy on here who has it - maybe he'll speak up.
There are a few, but I think I am the only one on XOC with the TC kit. So, what's the question? confused
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 26/07/07 06:48 PM

I have a couple if you don't mind. worth it? will 35" fit w/ bl? still streetable? do you have any pics up?
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 26/07/07 07:05 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Carlton McMillan:


Better parts don't always cure bad driving habits.
Slow down a bit and you will be fine.

W the SAS and BL you can pack 35s BUT.... the kit is designed around 33s.

I do have the SAS & 35s w/BL but I did beef up a few of the parts to make up for it.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 26/07/07 07:09 PM

As Carlton said, if you are blowing up diffs, the long arm kit won't help you...you'd still be fucked.

What kind of trails/4wheeling do you do? That will help us out to point you in the right direction.

Also, English is a great form of communication learn it [Wave]
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 26/07/07 07:19 PM

What English □is that? □you □□consider □my you to tie yahoos! ! wink
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 26/07/07 07:37 PM

as far as trails go. anywhere from rivers, mud holes to tight trees, rocks, hills & jumpin the dunes.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 26/07/07 10:11 PM

First of all, welcome grafhx.

Jumping dunes could be the problem. That kind of wheelin will put a shit load of stress on the IFS and especially the diff, CVs and hubs.

TC kit is good stuff but might not be your cure, especially if you plan running 35's. Those are big tires, so a lot of rotating mass = a lot of force when they finally hit the ground and get some grip.

You're likely to not break as much stuff if you go slower, as others said. Speed = Force = more stress = higher chances of breakage.

Stop by MXO, I see that you're smack in the middle between us nothern folks and some no less active southern city dudes as well.
Posted by: Silver Raider

Re: xterra chaos - 27/07/07 02:49 AM

Welcome. A lot of Cross country/baja type trucks race IFS so if your big into beaches and dunes, you probably just need to beef up what you have. to fit 35's under your IFS though you will need more than just a b/l. You'll need some kind of suspension lift as well and probably some creative body work to the wheel wells also.
Some of these replies were a little harsh, but I have to agree about considering your driving habits.
Kev(alpine) -PM
Posted by: TJ

Re: xterra chaos - 27/07/07 05:04 AM

Jumping is hard on components, the frame, everything...

If you want to do it with less breakage (in general), assuming the "go slower" thing is less obvious...try going "easier".

There are techniques to helping the truck survive....like matching wheel speed to ground speed while in the air...so when you land, there's less driveline shock (As opposed to being at full throttle as you take off, and leaving your foot on it until landing...so your tires are still acellerating in the air since you took away the resistance, etc...)

There's giving a little brake tap to weight the front end when about to hit a ledge/bump..before the bump, so the front end gets a little bounce up before the bump...so the truck is already on the way up as it hits, also reducing shock.

There's giving a little goose to the gas as the rear tires are coming down off the same bump (With traction...)...to squat the suspension/level the truck out on the way down, rather than have it come down hard and jounce, etc.

There's gassing when the drivetrain is straight and unobstructed, and coasting into/over obstructions, rather than juicing it into resistance, etc.

etc.

IE: If you break alot of stuff, you are like the novice skier who's bombing the mountain, but is pretty much out of control the whole way down, etc....if anything gets in your way...you end up going into it, rather than carving around it.

laugh

A little finese can help keep your repair bills down.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 27/07/07 08:16 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by grafhx:
I have a couple if you don't mind. worth it? will 35" fit w/ bl? still streetable? do you have any pics up?
The short answers....
Worth it? Hell yes.
35's? I wouldn't do it. There's really no room to stuff a 35 on compression like you need to when you are at speed.
Streetable? It's my daily driver.
Pics? They are around along with a video. Try a search.

I do agree with the others though. I am not sure the kit will cure your driving woes. Speed is not for everyone and although I probably post the highest average off-road speed here save for the 2nd generation racer, I have not broken anything serious. The TC kit is great, don't get me wrong and I'd do it all over again in a heartbeat. However, slowing down and staying within your limits and the limits of your machine goes a long way. I'm not saying don't mod your X as you want either. If you are driving within your limits, it may :rolleyes: be just a matter of getting your rig to keep up. Skill and expense are inversely proportionate IMO. As you skill increases, the likelihood of major repair bills decreases. Just remember, when it comes down to it, dirt hurts.

EDIT TO ADD:

After thinking about it I wouldn't do the body lift either. It just lifts the center of gravity higher and you really don't want that when you are going fast. Take a look at the high end racers in something like the Baja or Dakar. Lots of travel but lower to the ground than you might expect. Drift in the dirt is fine, and I know I do my share of that when appropriate like in a river bed or a dune scenario, but rolling just plain sucks. My two cents.
Posted by: TJ

Re: xterra chaos - 27/07/07 03:34 PM

Well, the BL doesn't add much to the COG, as its light compared to the frame and drivetrain, etc...but a better solution for an off road bomber is to just remove the fenders to clear for compression.

laugh
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 27/07/07 04:06 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by TJ:
Well, the BL doesn't add much to the COG, as its light compared to the frame and drivetrain, etc...but a better solution for an off road bomber is to just remove the fenders to clear for compression.

laugh
You could but then it does not remain legal for the street as opposed to going with some glass fenders.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 27/07/07 04:47 PM

thanks for the info. driving skills are fine. trucks not equipped enough. i know i beat the shit out of it. still no body damage. heres some pics. http://s196.photobucket.com/albums/aa225/grafhx/?act http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa225/grafhx/HPNX0176.jpgion=view¤t=a7fe6 http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa225/grafhx/HPNX0178.jpg951.pbw
not sure if that worked.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 27/07/07 07:11 PM

Going through the pics it looks like you guys are generating some wheel spin and trying to use momentum to make up for loss of traction. I think you need a locker more than 35s or SAS
Posted by: TJ

Re: xterra chaos - 27/07/07 07:25 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by grafhx:
[QB]thanks for the info. driving skills are fine. trucks not equipped enough.
[Uh Oh !]

So - If I get your logic, you are breaking stuff because you are exceeding the limits of your equipment...on purpose.

I do it the otherway around...I figure breakage costs $, and causes downtime...so I don't break things on purpose...

..And If there's something I WANT to do, that the truck can't, I build to DO IT, then, DO IT.

That way...I HAVE a truck to modify as I need it, rather than a wrecked POS that would make a poor base to build from.

laugh

So - It IS your driving...and you are doing it on purpose...so you are OK with it. Its your truck, and your $, if you want to abuse the equipment, its your equipment and your right to do it...

...Just take responsibility for causing the damage, and enjoy.

laugh
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 27/07/07 11:14 PM

i take full responibility, i abuse it and wanna make it stronger. thats why i'm here. yes i can slow down, i want the alternative + rock crawl. as far as breakage on purpose, no im not rich. i work my ass off. i just wanna know how far it can go. mind you i drive safe, obey signs & crossings, SAFETY'S #1, but LIMITS are QUESTIONABLE.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 27/07/07 11:22 PM

ALPINE-lockers on the list, buddy has it, like night/day.
Posted by: TJ

Re: xterra chaos - 28/07/07 08:28 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by grafhx:
hey e1. i could use a lil advice, i play hard & always breakin something. .... truck has 25k on it, blew motor at 12k ....2 altern. broke sway way t-bar. driver side warn hub, pass. side lower control has a nice crack through it, and know i have a nasty clicking noise in front axle. think a spider gear cracked, ..... THANKS 4 UR KNOWLEDGE
GRAFHX
Quote:
Originally posted by grafhx:
thanks for the info. driving skills are fine. trucks not equipped enough. i know i beat the shit out of it.
Quote:
Originally posted by grafhx:
.....SAFETY'S #1, but LIMITS are QUESTIONABLE.
I hear you...but, maybe you're asking the wrong questions...I mean, sure limits are questionable...but, they still exist for a given situation.

You have a litany of breakage, and claim to beat the shit out of it...and you have the proof you beat the shit out of it..no question.

So - I have to say, you are beating the shit out of it on purpose...even your captions for the pics are along the lines of this concept.

So, if you KNOW you ARE beating the shit out of it, and you KNOW whatever questions you had about the limits were ANSWERED, SEVERAL TIMES in fact....IE: You don't care, and you are proud of not caring.

If I said I was climbing Mt Everest during a blizzard, And I didn't make it because it was blowing 300 mph and was 120 degrees below zero...I would not blame it on my equipment, it would be due to my stupidity in thinking that I could MAKE IT under conditions that I was wrong about.

Knowing what your equipment can handle is part of driving skill...no successful racer just floors it the entire race, or runs over debris he could avoid, etc...they know how to make the equipment last long enough to finish, and pick and choose what damage to risk based upon their experience.

So while an off road race like Baja, etc...might have trucks that CAN go 130 mph, etc...they might only go 40 mph over rough sections TO AVOID BREAKAGE...IE: Their driving skills involve knowing the limits of the equipment.

So - You are a kid (Compared to an old fart), and you have not gained these skills yet. That's OK, we were all young and foolish once...don't feel bad.

You say you work your ass off, and you don't want to waste locker money on repairs...that's the first step...

...So, you ARE on your way.

laugh
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 28/07/07 08:39 PM

TJ i guess he annoyed the crap out of ya too.
Posted by: TJ

Re: xterra chaos - 28/07/07 08:50 PM

Kids...whatcha gonna do?

laugh

They're lke that...I broke stuff, rolled, etc...when I was a teeny bopper....its part of growing up for some.

My kids, different, very responsible and mature from the beginning, they went to college, grad school, etc...never a problem.

Me, I left home early...and was a bit more trouble.

laugh
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 28/07/07 09:06 PM

haha you might be surprized. Im 16 myself.
Posted by: TJ

Re: xterra chaos - 28/07/07 09:33 PM

LOL

I've been 16 too many times.

laugh
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 29/07/07 10:22 AM

man, this is a tough crowd."0" im 32 years old, not a teeny booper. eric in the pics is my nefhew, 17 years old, i take him w/ let him drive. tj it seems im hurting you abusing my truck frown . i know my trucks limits, i want it better. jumping is my down fall. can't stop.(problem. i know). climbing rocks and driving through the woods too grandmothers house is fine. but im tired of sitting on the ground pushing the ball back and fouth. i want to stand up and throw it. so aside of the childish comments, i think you guys may have helped. choas suspension will help my ignorance, not cure it, and a locker to stay off the gas on the bigger rocks and steeper hills. THAK YOU!!!! i will start w/ a locker, and possibly 5.14 front and rear.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 29/07/07 11:34 AM

For jumping I would go with:

Total Chaos Front end lift kit
L&P Steering or Total Chaos
Spring over on the rear with ALCAN Leaf Springs
Locker, A locked truck will go further than an open lifted truck.

I am not saying you cant jump an SAS truck but Dessert runners are IFS for a reason.

Stay away from any big beefy bumpers (ARB, Calimini, TJM, Shrockworks) and if anything get a tube front done. Weight is your enemy so you need to start thinking of ways to keep it light and functional.
Posted by: FSRBIKER

Re: xterra chaos - 29/07/07 04:31 PM

Do you carry safety equipment with you,spare shafts/parts, have the knowledge to make trail repairs, tow strap, winch? I would also at least carry a stinger and cables to run a trail welder setup.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 29/07/07 04:50 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Alpine Spirit:
For jumping I would go with:

Total Chaos Front end lift kit
L&P Steering or Total Chaos
Spring over on the rear with ALCAN Leaf Springs
Locker, A locked truck will go further than an open lifted truck.

I am not saying you cant jump an SAS truck but Dessert runners are IFS for a reason.

Stay away from any big beefy bumpers (ARB, Calimini, TJM, Shrockworks) and if anything get a tube front done. Weight is your enemy so you need to start thinking of ways to keep it light and functional.
I'd do the SOA only if he still insisted on 35's. SUA with a fulle Deaver pack works great and does not run as high a risk of axle wrap, something I am sure he would experience.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 29/07/07 05:29 PM

yes, some equip/extras. tow strap, mech. wire, few small 2x4s, tools, no winch/welder. extra t-bars, alternator, misc. nuts/bolt.

yeah think ill leave the 35" as an itch for now, maybe scratch it later. locker for sure next week.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 29/07/07 08:09 PM

I would also check into hydraulic bump stops, that would help to take some of the impact. Also what kinda shocks u running?? Like mentioned stay lite. If that means gutting out the interior that will put less stress on your drive-tran and suspension.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: xterra chaos - 31/07/07 03:16 PM

currently running A/C articulator suspension package w/ RS9000X shocks,(9 adjustments). hydralic stops hmmm. ill check it out. thanks
Posted by: fastdrmr

Re: xterra chaos - 15/08/07 11:25 PM

My 2 cents since I am the spectator (co-driver) of the XterraRacer I can shed some light on how we make it JUMP. We have a set up that is custom - meaning lots of fab! The most important element, besides the obvious of added components through out, is understanding your shocks. The stiffer they are the better they will perform when landing hard. The front end on the X is very stiff however we manage to survive hours of pounding. The shocks absorb the load rather than letter components (bump stops, control arms, etc) - we have had failure when the shocks have not done their job due to set up.

Someone mentioned a locker... yes, its going to help keep your nose straight while lining up to hit the lip perpendicular... but I can tell you many of times we have launched and landed on 1 wheel... such would be the case if you did not have a locker (or spool). Overall, the locked rear will grant you more even transfer of power to the loose dirt. Additionally, the locker will provide more control in the corners as you can predict how it will react - consistently.

Desert racing WILL break parts. The list goes on and on, but we do it because we love it.

For more information and to chat more specifically with XterraRacer (Dave) please check us out at www.teamxterraracing.com

Robert