Which lift first

Okay, seeing as how funds are very limited, and wil be for a while...

which would be the wiser investment (and why). Body lift or a frame lift?


BTW the rock-sliders(nerf bars) are being fabricated as I type

The ONLY reason to put in a body lift is to make room for bigger tires. Personally I don't care for them when a suspension lift is available ...

A suspension lift offers more height (and thus room for bigger tires), but should also offer more articulation or at least return your articulation to stock specs.

EDIT - BL's are much cheaper, but require much more time to install. SL's are expensive, but don't take as much time to install.

[ 10-17-2001: Message edited by: Philosopher ]

Can't answer your question, but you might want to consider that your sliders will have to be rebuilt to integrate with a body lift.

Brent

How does a 3" suspension lift offer more height than a 3" body lift? Actually a 3" body lift is better to fit larger tires, you are not increasing your travel which can lead to more contact problems. But I agree if the choice is there go with the suspension lift first as the new torsion bars/add aleafs can better handle the extra weight of the larger tires.

A suspension lift DOES NOT allow you to run bigger tires. Under articulation, larger tires will rub with a suspesion lift. They will not on a body lift.

I really don't care what it LOOKS like.

In fact, I'm leaning towards the body lift first... as the rock rails can still be used as effective steprails for the kids gettin i and out.. if I lift the suspension, the rails goe up with the rest of the frame.
so if I do the body first, I get the body up out of harms way, and the kids can still get in and out.. hmmm.....

A suspension lift offers more height compared to stock. The only time I actually compared BL's with SL's was in my edit.

[ 10-18-2001: Message edited by: Philosopher ]

Untrue.

Twisting the torsion bars is (part of) a 'poor man's lift' and enables you to run 32" tires under an Xterra whereas without doing that you can only fit 31's. I'm not trying to argue here, just trying to point out the logic.

(cough)Bullshit(cough)

If 32's fit with a torsion tweak, or a suspension lift, they'll fit without it.

Compression travel is the same.

*sigh*

Fine. Anyone out there fit 32's without cranking the torsion bars?

They'll fit regardless, but they're far more prone to rubbing at the top under compression if the t-bar pre-load isn't increased. By tweaking the bars you increase the distance from rest that the tire must travel to strike the inside of the wheel well, and cause more force to be used in the process because the t-bar gets twisted more as it travels the extra distance, but in the end, the tire can travel just as far into the well either way. It's just takes a harder stuff to do it.

Make sense yet?
Brent

There is no way you can drive on the street with 32's unless you adjust the torsion bars, we all know about the travel issue and offroad but not a single person has been able to install 32's without adjusting the t-bars.

I think we all agree on that FSR, but that is not the point. The point is that you are going to rub the shit out of your tires under compression.....unless you apply a body lift, so that the tires cannot compress as far into the wells.

I think we are all basically arguing the same point here, though....

My 32's don't rub at all under compression ...

[ 10-18-2001: Message edited by: Philosopher ]

Then you're missing a lot of travel, have filed everything away, or your tires have worn down to 30s.

It's so simple.
Adjusting the ride changes nothing but the static ride height. The suspension travels from upper bumpstop to lower bumpstop, and nothing changes that.

Under full compression, the wheel is in exactly the same place regardless of how the torsion bars are set.

This is a fact, and I'm surprised non of you can understand it.

Yes, but it makes for a stiffer ride, and poor articulation.

IMO - I've been out wheelin' with you before. I would just go with a aal or shackle in the rear and 1 - 1 1/2" torsion bar crank. Less money, for one, and from what I've seen you go over at stock hight, you don't really need to go much higher than that. You choose smart lines and with the new sliderz coming, you won't have to worry about your rockers getting slammed. It will just allow you to take a more difficult line. Save your $$$ and go for skids and tires (like Geoff did).
Just a thought

[ 10-19-2001: Message edited by: stormy ]

I understand that just fine but that's not the point. The point is you CANNOT run 32" tires without cranking the torsion bars (or taking the fenders off).

Yes you can, I know of someone who is, with no problems.

FICTION.

Are you talking out of your ass again?

Who is it and what tires?

had to go look at your profile to figure out who you were.... duh.

Ohh that pictuer in the profile... CLASSIC!



Can you do one without the other?
What would just a shackel cost me and more importantly what would it buy me in clearence?



Awe shucks, Stop it your making me blush.



ayah




well, there is a lot of water on the Class-VI's near my house, I'd like to get the X up out of that water as much as possible.

And I must admit I raher like the look of a lifted-X..



I'll be making some skids count on that..


I'm thinking to splurge and use diamond-plate teeeheeehaaahaaaa

Dave in RMXC, 32" BFG All Terrain KO's.

I wish I had the time to remove my lift kit to show you that it works just fine, and I wish you could offer me some physcal proof that by raising the ride height with the torsion bars somehow magically makes the wheel well larger.

If 32's fit with a suspension lift, or cranked torsion bars, they must fit a stock vehicle, because the physical size and geometry of the vehicle and suspension has not changed.

So he hasn't cranked the torsion bars at all and doesn't have rubbing problems?

As far as I know, no. And I have witnessed any problems.

You still haven't explained why this rubbing wouldn't happen with the front end raised.
Are you just saying it wont rub when driven on the street ?

If your 32's aren't rubbing off-road, then you're not getting full travel up front (possibly limited by RS9000 shocks).

Mine touch the underside of the fender well when fully compressed.

I'm just saying that I don't have rubbing problems, and haven't for as long as I can remember ... although I've had the same tires you have now for 2 years. I'll let you know how the 32" KM's handle when I put them on next week.

I have the exact same shocks you do, the Bilstein B46-1099-H2.

Drive it harder. You should be able to pluck the little snap grommets off the plastic wheel well insert with the tires under full compression.

My ARB has also cut the outside lugs of the tire half an inch deep. Need to modify that bumper.

Yes, I would go with an aal = 3" but a shackle is a bit easier to install. You're looking at about $50-$60 for ether part. CHEAP STUFF!


Then you want a suspension lift. A body lift will only bring the body up higher, not the engine etc..

My advice after having both the shackles and the AAL, is to use the AAL first. It gives you better response from the rear leafs, while the shackles tend to just flatten what arc you have left in your leafs. Both cost the same, but it's really not that hard to install the AAL. Then if you raise the front end you can always add shackles later, or get a new spring pack to even things out.

Since we're all offering advice, I recommend saving up until you can buy a complete lift kit from a single manufacturer, instead of hobbling something together.

Good advice Ian, thats my plan....
Also as far as the rubbing issue, I have 265 75 16s and havent had any rubbing if that helps and of course no t-bar cranking

Or start a web site and get the lift for free. That's a lot of cash for most people. While it would be nice to put in a whole lift kit at once, I've learned alot about each compenent and what difference it makes by going piecemeal. Eventually I'll have a whole SLR kit in, but going in steps makes it easier on the pocketbook, and I'm getting immediate performance gains instead of driving a stocker for a year+ untill I have cash.

Anyway, just another opinion.

Not really.

Raise your hand if you bought an ARB bull bar and some lights, or a big stereo.

For that price you could have an entire lift kit from several manufacturers.

I spent 500 on a Stereo. that was speakers, sub and amp. The only reason i have no lift yet is because i am trying to get myself out of debt.