Rear Locker Options

What are my options for Rear lockers (besides arb)?

I've read alot about the ARB locker, but i'm looking for something else that doesn't involve air.

Are there electric lockers currently available? If not, are their companies that still have plans to release other locker options for the xterra? possible soon?

As far as I know, the only current options are the ARB air locker, Chris Locker, or a lincoln locker.

For a daily driver, the only option is an ARB.

So far, there are other options in the works, akin to cold fusion as far as scheduling.

So your other option beside ARB is, well, none.

HAHA.. just what i thought. :rolleyes: Crap.

Thanks guys!.. i'll think about ARB some more then.

I spoke with folks at Auburn Gear recently about their new ECTED (electronically controlled traction enhancing device) for the X. It's not currently available, but I wa blown off with the line, "we'll check in to the need for one in the market." When it's "off" it's a limited slip diff and when it's "on", it's a full locker. Unique in that it can be switched on the fly at any speed , no forks or pins to engage for full lock. (most of that blurb is from their advertising...) It lists retail for under $700 and I have called them evey week as someone new for two months now, expressing interest in it , and I suggest y'all do too www.auburngear.com

"I have called them evey week as someone new for two months now, expressing interest in it , and I suggest y'all do too www.auburngear.com"

CRAFTY... I like.. If they come out soon I'll give you the credit for it.

This will be a distant upgrade for me, but I wonder what the reliability factor will be. I assume the ARB (Air-locker) has proven itself by now.

Quick question. I've been pondering what affect a rear locker has on front wheel spin. Any thoughts? 3 tires on terra firma what will tire 4 do when skinny pedal is applied?

Conundrum - either I'm missing part of your question, or you are asking what happens to a front tire when the rear tires turn?

All the rear locker is doing is making the rear tires turn in unison, rather than just the fastest turning tire getting the torque...

So, the front tires just turn like they always would....and if you apply the skinny pedal, they turn faster...the open diff fronts act like open diff fronts...and the faster tire gets the torque, and the rears turn in unison...but faster.

If any thing, if the front tires are being pushed along by the locked rear, they have a better chance of turning at the same rate, as they are not required to supply as much traction, and so one of them is somewhat less likely to lose traction, spin, and steal all of the torque.

So, if front tire 4 is in the air, and the other three are on terra firma (or even on Xterra Firma...)...the rear locked tires push the truck foward, the tire in the air gets the front torque, and spins, in the air, at the same speed as the rear tires are turning...the front tire on the ground rolls along for the ride.

Is that what you were asking?

Perfect explaination... That's what I was thinking, but without having a locker (Only LSD) I had no way of knowing.
So in fact, I may be able to reduce wheel spin of the front tires if the rear are locked.
Thanks...!

Now that sounds exaclty like what i'm looking for! I'll start callin them too. Thanks DBAX!

I emailed them just now. Would be nice to have options.

You could just put a spool in it!!!!

Tim

Tim, please let every one know who makes spools that would fit.

- Thanks!

Ya, post a few links for the spools...

Oh ye of little faith:

http://www.nissanoffroad.net/messageboard/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=13949

I had a ball with my Detroit last weekend...

How to install a 31-spline Detroit No-Spin into a 2000+ vintage Frontier or Xterra 33-spline H233B:

Parts needed:

4-spider gear open carrier from any later vintage H233B (not the 2-spider from the 2wds)

Axle shaft seals for 31-spline H223B

Replacement gasket between 3rd and housing

Axle shaft assemblies from a 1999 King Cab V6 Frontier 4x4

Detroit No-Spin (get one while you still can!) or Lockrite

Tools Needed:

Good set of basic hand tools/socket set

Torque wrench

Dial indicator/mag base

Seal puller

Seal driver

Optional (if you need to swap carrier bearings or remove tone-rings on axleshafts)...

Bearing splitter

Harmonic balancer puller

Press

Supplies needed:

3 qts. Gear oil

Grease

Brake fluid

Tons of rags

Lots of cleaner

Boat-loads of patience!

Work required:

1. Clean everything near the axle tube ends and 3rd member areas thoroughly.

2. Pull axleshafts out of axle, set aside. If you did not get axleshafts with all the brake backing plates/hardware/etc, you will need to disassemble these axleshafts to transplant your brakes.

3. Drain diff, remove driveshaft, unbolt and remove 3rd member, if 2wd uplug ABS signal wire. Be sure to keep all of these parts away from dirt and foreign matter.

4. Disassemble 4-spider carrier and remove all the guts, then drop the Detroit in, reassemble and torque.

5. Unbolt the bearing caps and remove the carrier and ring gear from the 3rd.

6. Remove ring gear from carrier and transplant onto the carrier with the Detroit and torque it. Be sure to carefully and thoroghly clean and degrease the area where the ring gear contacts the carrier to ensure the smallest runout.

7. Install carrier assembly back into 3rd and finger-tighten bearing caps. Adjust backlash and preload. No need to check pattern on worn-in gearset that has not had the pinion adjusted. Torque bearing caps and install locking tabs when done.

8. Reinstall carrier into axle assembly.

9. Remove axle shaft oil seals and install the new slightly smaller ones. These are a pain to get out, they have very thin metal bonded to the rubber and deform/tear easily. Install new oil seals.

10. Pre-lube axleshafts and install into axle tube. Reconnect brake lines and bleed.
Reinstall driveshaft.

11. Fill diff with a high-quality fluid.

12. Go WHEELIN!

After many many hours of research and cross-referencing of part numbers, I found that the carrier bearings on 1995 and newer H233Bs are all the same to this day.

So almost any H233B carrier fits all others.

The 1999 31-spline axle shafts are the only ones that are the correct length to run in a Frontier/Xterra housing because of the increased track width over the old Hardbodies.

The new shaft seals are necessary because the axle is physically (slightly) smaller in diameter and the 33-spline seals will not seat on the 31-spline axle.

To ease the work spend a few extra $$ for the complete axle assemblies with all the brake hardware. Then it becomes a matter of just swapping parts.

I removed the tone-rings from the axleshafts (since my 2wd housing has the ABS on the pinion snout) to make trail-side repair/replacement easier.

They are pressed on after the bearing locknuts and will prevent removal of the shaft from the cage unless they are pulled off first.

Y'all with 4x4 housings can skip that step since you need them on there.

The result:

For less work (and less $$) than an ARB I have a locked rear end that I do not have to worry about air-lines, gasket seals, and an air source.

Find your parts locally and you may pay less than I did ($700) to do the project.

Keep in mind I already own all the specialized tools needed to do the work so if you don't you will have to figure that in...

*Pics and additional writeup available on my website under the MODS section*
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-Chris
http://home.sprintmail.com/~onlyone/index.html
The Only One: Locked 2001 4x4 Desert Runner...
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Oh, its like a drop in then.

It takes just as much effort to install an ARB carrier. You still have to completely disconnect and pull the axles, 3rd, and then tear the 3rd apart. The only difference in the install is that you change the axle seals and go back with different axles.

Don't mention the fact that you have to install an air source, run air lines and tap your housing for an ARB. Now, which is more of a drop in?

Chris - We are trying to avoid the hassle of installing an ARB...your solution is no worse, and if you have the tools, the mechanical skills, and a source of used/new parts required, your solution is a viable option, no question.

For myself, just trying to find all of the parts you were able to get would use of massive amounts of time and effort...around here, the salvage yards and used parts places just don't have the flexibility in taking what you need, like I'd have to get the whole axle assembly just to get the axle parts, etc...

I'm also not sure what compromises in strength were made to downgrade to 31 spline axle shafts from the 33's...the extra block in the pathy type housing might compensate....for example, but I'm not sure of the end results strength compared to the original point, is it break even, or just weaker shaft wise, or somewhere around that?

At least it would be WAY more fun off road.

You don't have to pull the axles completely when you install an ARB. You only have to pull them out +/- 1", to disconnect them at the carrier, so you can pull out the 3rd. Which means you don't have to touch any brake lines, abs, etc., on the axles. There's enough slack in all the lines to pull the axles out 1" without hurting anything.

Other than that, yeah, it's about the same amount of effort.

Besides, people, no matter what type of spool you put into the X, you're STILL going to have to do all this, 'cause you have to remove the 3rd member. About the only real difference in the ARB install, is that you have to take the ring gear off, and put it on the ARB carrier. So you're talking a few bolts difference... Big whoopie.

If you don't have enough mechanical skills to take the 3rd out (aka, pulling the axle shafts out), you don't have enough skill to install a locker, no matter what type it is.

It took me all of 10 minutes between searching online and calling 2 yards to find the shafts, purchase them, and have them shipped. Another 10 minute phone call to AC to order a locker and another 10 minute phone call to get the carrier. I stopped by the dealer on my way home one day to pick up the seals (stock item). Total time invested, possibly an hour, no more.

Some make it sound WAY too hard to buy parts for anything. Have you really even tried? I have only ever purchased one part local (because the yards do not have nissans), everything else I search online and buy over the phone.

You want an easier route to get a locker? Pay someone to completely install an ARB.

the pay to install route is that I am going to do..
My truck is to expensive to put out of service for a few weeks while someone else fixes what I screwed up.. The costs may be alot cheaper to diy if you have some idea what you are doing.. Even $500 savings at each end isn't worth frying gears in 20k miles.. Electrical I understand..
Backlash I have no idea what is right & wrong..
On another note I was told that a full time locker is bad on ice.. mainly in corners.. wouldn't an arb be a better option for the weekend warrior in the snow / ice?

Yes, an ARB is better if the rig will see the majority of use on pavement. You have to relearn how to drive, when you have a full-time locker. Not a big deal, 'cause you learn pretty quickly how to spin the rear end around... Takes a little bit of finess to learn how to NOT spin it around.

Anyways, the ARB install really is straightforward. You can save a lot of $$ by doing all of the install except the backlash setup. Since it's a 3rd member, you can easily take the 3rd to a shop that will set the backlash for you. Should only be around $30 to $70, depending.

The ARB comes with very good, vehicle specific, directions, with lots of pictures. It really is simple enough for an average DIY, even if you've never torn the rear down before.

I know this, because I did mine, without ever taking a 3rd member out before. It was a piece of cake, and was done in one afternoon. So if you can have your truck down for a day, you can do it. There really isn't anything to mess up, per say. It only goes together 1 way.

Selectable lockers are always more flexible...I never had a locked X, in the Jeeps, I can tell you that you have to pay attention to the conditions when locked....icy off camber for example is a real test...the locked tires tend to crab down hill, and if trying to make a tight turn, the locked fronts tend to push wide on the turn.

On road, the tires can chirp, etc on turns until you get the hang of accel/decel factors that kick in the lock.

In short, there is a learning curve for driving a locked rig...you do get used to it though, but it is a compromise of capabilities.

If you are willing to put in the learning time, it would work for you, if you are worried that you'll get into too much trouble in the process of learning, then the selectable locker is a better choice.

Why lock and go 31 spline whe you already have 33 spline axles is a fair argument. But, how many people are snapping rear shafts on their X's? (Genuine question, i really don't know)

I know a 31 spline out of a hardbody is a 1.3" axle, the same diameter as the shafts in my trail rig. It has 35" tires, a 72:1 lowrange, a spooled rearend, puts out 275 lbs of torque, and weighs almost 5,000 lbs dry. In 2 years of wheeling I have yet to lose a rear shaft whether it be in the mud, rocks, or on the trail. U-joints and transmission mounts are another story, it seems that when I shock an axle they go out first.

So is it really that huge of a deal?

Justin

There are starting (and I say starting, because it's still a very few) that have broken the rear axle, with the 33 splines. Might be because the X's and Fronty's are relatively new. Might be because the majority of owners/drivers out there don't drive their vehicle nearly as hard as they claim. Might be that there's not too many that are locked that actually drive thier vehicle to its limits.

The point is, once you have a locker, you're going to be driving on much harder stuff than you did before. If you aren't, then you didn't need a locker in the first place. So intentionally dropping down to a weaker part doesn't make sense, unless it's going to save you a buttload, like it did for DR.

I would imagine that the 31 spline rear axle is strong enough for the majority of Nissan offroaders that are out there, because lets be honest, there's really only a handfull of Nissan drivers that are currently driving their rigs to their limit. I doubt we'll see too much breakages of rear axles, until there are more of us that have the truck paid off, and are more willing to go for it, offroad.

The H233B rear axle is only a little stronger than a Dana 44, and we all know (or at least we ought to) that you can break a Dana 44 offroading. The nissan axle isn't any different, or immune to that. It's not indestructible. There's just very few of us that are willing to push it to the limit.

I'll let y'all know if I break a shaft. Until that happens, (and a trail-side shaft replacement ensues), I will not worry about it in the least.

Besides, I won't have to beat on it the truck as hard for some obstacles simply because I am not coping with the rear end spinning a tire due to my formerly worthless LSD.

Plenty of people have been building and wheeling the crap out of HBs and HB Pathy's with 31-spline axles. Very few are breaking. I'll keep wheelin.

Well, in the jeeps at least, the D44 was Ok for 33's, and 35's if you were careful...so the Nissan unit should be at least as applicable, as almost no one is hard core wheeling X's with larger than 35's...perhaps a few dozen or so, and not even a huge number with larger than 33's are out there.

This is one of those areas where time will tell.

The more options for lockers that we develop, the better, and if no one takes a chance on developing something new, Like Chris did, we'd never know.

If it proves its worth, it will be adopted, and we can call it a Chris Locker in his honor.