Developing Story

Holy crap, I count my blessings that I am not part of the 1000-1500 sent to that shithole. Not sure what the purpose with this is, one thing I can imagine is that the mission is going to be shit with the same crap now going on in Iraq, hit and runs.

Spoke to a former French Foreign Legionaire last week who fought in Chad and the Congo, he told be that part of Africa is so fucked up that creating peace or any kind of democracy is out of the question....I tend to believe him.

I would say the Legionnaire was right.

We shouldn't get involved. The Europeans are applying some pressure for us to get involved. So is Kofi Annan. The same ones who didn't want us to go into Iraq. The French send 200 soldiers to Sierra Leone and what? They are tapped out already? No more troops to send anywhere else?

I say the Europeans should take care of this. If they want to have an EU to counteract American power then they have to get off their asses and send troops to places like this when THEY feel the need. Europe doesn't do shit about problems in it's own backyard. Europeans did little in the Balkans. We had to go over there. Europeans (with UK the exception) don't do much militarily anymore but ask us whenever it is convienent for THEM. They want the US to do the dirty work that they don't want to do.

We don't have any interests in this country. European and West African peacekeepers are what's needed. Not American.

Bush should realize if he does this he will be putting troops in the possible position of shooting children. Taylor's army consists of a large number of armed children. The lefties and the anti-American and anti-military media will have a field day. The NY Times will love it. All for a place with no American interests that is a shithole anyway.

But you are for us in Iraq? Your points are contradictory. Ya know that if Liberia had large reserves of oil we'd already been in knee deep. Or if Taylor had rasberried daddy Bush...

What is it with you liberals and the Daddy Bush-Saddam thing?

You can be assured if there were oil there the Europeans would be involved at a larger scale. They also wouldn't want us involved at all if there were oil.

What contradiction? Iraq was a justifiable war with clear positives for the Iraqi people, the US and the Middle East.

This Liberia thing is just another shithole and a situation with no end. We just don't belong there. It will become a political disaster.

Why do you assume that I'm a liberal? Because I don't agree with Bush? If Bush was a Democrat, I still would not trust him. He's oil, he's big business, he's let's make money for my friends, he's bummed that daddy look's bad by not finishing off Saddam.

Quote:

You can be assured if there were oil there the Europeans would be involved at a larger scale. They also wouldn't want us involved at all if there were oil.

So, than why not Iraq. It has HUGE reserves... Another contradictory statement. From the point you just made they should be there like fly's-on-sh!t. They were against the war before it started, and they are against it now.

Quote:

What contradiction? Iraq was a justifiable war with clear positives for the Iraqi people, the US and the Middle East.

Than why not Lebanon, Iran and Syria. If we go beyond the middle east, whay not add in Congo and North Korea?

Oh, and let's through in Cuba for good measure. Oops, can't so that. Might mess up brother's chances at re-election...

Quote:

This Liberia thing is just another shithole and a situation with no end. We just don't belong there. It will become a political disaster.

Sounds like arguments against Kosovo, Germany, Japan, and the list goes on... If we are going to be the world's police man, we need to take responsibility for our actions, we did so in Japan and Germany. It is even more important to make sure we have reasons, not the ghosts of a decade gone by.

I got news for you pal... Bush is a Democrat! Half a one at least.

I like his foreign policy so far but his domestic policy has been pure DEMOCRAT. Expand government, expand government, spend, spend, spend.... He's been worse than a Democrat.

However... until a better horse comes into the race, who else is there to support?

Regarding the war... yeah I was for it. But I am certainly not for deploying our troops all over the world as peacekeepers. We still have many troops in Bosnia for 10 years. Kosovo for five years. They are European problems. We should be out of there. The large number of troops in Germany should be out of there.

Liberia is a mistake. Let the Europeans deal with it. Aren't they the ones who have historically abused and taken advantage of West African nations?

Amen Madman!.

Liberia is an un-solvable cest pool that should be left alone. My Mother-inlaw asked the ex Legionaire what would solve the problem adn he replied, more guns...let them destroy eachother, there is nothing we can do and he was absolutly right.

If Bush sends even 1 troop in there he is making a mistake, The UN is tapped out and does not have the resources nor the political organisation to do any impact other getting their asses kicked.

If you had say 25 million Dollars to waste you could easily overthrow a government of, say Togo ro that size...get some starvin Marvins to do the dirty work, put in a crooked Government and Voila' you have yourself a nice little passport to a shithole.

Oh boo hoo. Of course the US would have a greater interest if oil was involved. Why does everyone "trash talk" oil all the time?!?! Seriously, whenever a region that is home to one of the most precious resources in the world is in turmoil, our antennas will go up.

Africa is a doomed continent and it will always be just that.

Once again, you can't compare these countries to Liberia. I'm not even going to address the Germany and Japan reference.

Kosovo, the stability of Eastern Europe is of much greater concern to the US than that of Liberia. Sure, it's a shitty thing to say, but that's how the world works.

what is the solution for Liberia then, for all of you that think we should not go over there? let them kill themselves? seriously, this is what the US Military does, we restore peace where others are afraid to. i do not agree with the President all the time, but if we don't step in, who will? face the facts people, US Military is here to clean up other peoples messes, that is what we do. it seems to me that non-military people are the ones who are against any type of US intervention into anything. in stead of wasting your energy on complaining about the military getting involved in everything, expel your energy on thanking the men and women who have to go and protect and restore peace to shit holes like Liberia. all of this Anti-war and Anti-Bush is getting old.

While I appreciate your point about thanking the military, you are off base in a few areas. First, I took an oath "to uphold and defend the Constitution of the United States", not to "restore peace to shit holes like Liberia". If you talk to almost anyone in the military most will say that they loath peacekeeping, and for good reason. If you look at our training you will notice the complete absence of any that involves "peacekeeping".
The above does not mean that I dont care about the suffering of those unfortunate people. I just dont see how sending the military would help anything. Unfortunatly I do not know what would help them.

Not even the UN is trained in Peace keeping. I took a 3 week course in riot control and avoiding getting killed as we could not return fire.

Remember Vietnam?. what is happening in Iraq right now is a perfect example of that tactical warfare. Seriously. you can not liberate a country or restore peace IF there is no will to conform from the general population...let them rot

Call it sick human curiosity (like rubber-neckers gawking at a highway crash), but who would you consider as a viable conservative republican candidate for President? It's a fair bet it's NOT someone who's on the board at Walmart, eh?

Interesting I would have thought that the UN would get a lot of peacekeeping training.
To be honest, in all my training, I have never even heard the word mentioned!
As far as Liberia goes,I hear what your saying, I do not want to be involved, but I still feel bad for them.

What's wrong with being anti-war??

There is a hundred other places just like it...why Liberia? Soldiers should be concerned with accomplishing mission objectives (killing the enemy) not providing a dog and pony show for the folks in Washington. I like what were doing in Iraq more for personal reasons than anything sensible, but with this Bush is starting to look more and more like an ass, hell I might even vote Democrat this time (not that it would do any good, have you seen the losers running?).

Just out of curiosity, what's wrong with some of them? I've not been paying attention to them at this point, and some are obvious no-go's (Sharpton, anyone?). But why would you consider Kerry or Edwards losers?

What foreign policy???? His foreign policy consists of "Do what I say or I'm sending in the troops!!!"

His foreign policy is crap. If he and the administration don't get things tuned around in Iraq soon, he is going to have major problems come election time. Vietnam showed that the American public doesn't like to see their sons and daughters coming home in body bags, especially when the war is considered over.

I was all for the US going in and getting rid of Saddam. But I thought they would have at least some sort of plan to get the country back on its feet ASAP. For as much lip service they paid to making sure we knew the bombing runs were planned to keep as many services up and running, you would think they would be able to get things operating better than they do now.

If they don't start making life easier for the Iraqi's soon, there are going to be more of our soldiers comming home in caskets, and Bush is going to start feeling the heat even more.

Or thanking God that I m not the one who has to concuct some bullshit story how they died for their country trying to outs this weeks dictator FOR WHAT!!. only to see the next flavor of the month scoot in waiving a few hundred AK's and take over the country again?. I was in Namibia for 2 years with UNTAG (UN) do I think we did any good installing a communist government that has made the poor people and the native bushmen even worse off?.FUCK no I am ashamed.I think it is time to realize that we can not change the face of the 3rd world by intervention with force, It is like pissing your pants in frosty weather to keep warm..only lasts for a moment.
Yes I do feel moist for the innocent folks dying for no reason but put one finger in the dam...

Claus ... They made you wear one of those blue helmets? That in itself is a war crime.

You know one day we will have to talk more about this "installing a Communist government" thing...?

Back to the main subject ... Liberia sucks!!....

21 years old and full of thestosterone, all I wanted was to see action, well I got it. Wearing a UN beret is not a bad thing if you know nothing about the civil administration behind the UN wasting Billions of dollars on shit. I did 2 tours in Nambibia and 6 months in Cypres. Pay was good and touring Africa in a UN Mercedes G wagon ragtop for free was a treat especially with a HK rifle under the seat.

Funny story, the guy who was in charge of our ident cards was a local black guy (or should I say SWAPO). he was always smiling when he processed people in. The cards were made on a PC them laminated (real secure) all the cards had a dark line on the buttom which all thought were just a contrast line WRONG. This fucker had managed to type a line then scaling it down so it was unreadable. We found out by putting a card under a scope. it said something like this:

iamunscumwhohasinvadedournativenamibiatoaidethewhiteopression.

real clever.

Posted By Guido

They have a plan, you can blame the State Department for undermining it at every turn. Fuck this implementing Democracy crap until we can do a Macarthur and get those animals under control.

I do tend to agree with this. Why are people expecting immediate results? When has that ever been the case?

I was talking with my brother the other day, who is in Baghdad. He said that when he chats with Iraqis, one of the consistant themes in their chats is that they have a hard time conceptualizing the future. They can talk in detail about the past and how they feel about, as well as the present, they are throughly aware of the present, but when he tries to engage them in disscusions about the future, they have trouble. He said that most truly have difficulty thinking about anything that has to do with what is to come.

there is nothing wrong with being anti-war mobycat. nobody wants war, but sometimes there is no other solution. i just don't like the bashing of the people who have to go and fight those wars, and then listening to the people who have nothing to do with the military bitching about us going there and doing it. do i agree with the Liberia incident, i can't say, because i am not there and i do not know what is going on behind the scenes, unless you are directly involved with the situation, either in the White House or there in Liberia, how can you say what is best for the people of Liberia or say that we should not be there. how many people here are truly educated about the Liberian issue, other then what is put out on CNN of FOX NEWS? if you are, i would love to know the true story about Liberia, becasue there is a chance i might get deployed to that region.

I agree, but the problem is that some people seem to think being anti-war is being anti-soldier, which it's not. I still leaning toward the view that we didn't need to go into Iraq. However, I WILL support the troops and the task that has been handed to them. I don't have to accept that they were sent there in the first place.