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#212707 - 17/10/05 01:01 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by 2manytoyz:
Well, mine never broke, and having owned it for a year, and spent actual time talking with other owners in person and online, I sure didn't read about them breaking their Wranglers either.....
I don't havta read about it. I see them on the trails.

If you do trails like Engineer pass they're fine. But anything difficult will snap those axles in a NY minute.

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#212708 - 17/10/05 01:04 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by JeffW:
Quote:
Originally posted by 2manytoyz:
[b]Well, mine never broke, and having owned it for a year, and spent actual time talking with other owners in person and online, I sure didn't read about them breaking their Wranglers either.....
I don't havta read about it. I see them on the trails.

If you do trails like Engineer pass they're fine. But anything difficult will snap those axles in a NY minute.[/b]
So your stock axles are stronger than the stock Dana 44s on the Wrangler Rubicon? These are also available on all Wranglers, right from the dealership with full warranties.

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#212709 - 17/10/05 01:39 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by 2manytoyz:
Quote:
Originally posted by JeffW:
[b]
Quote:
Originally posted by 2manytoyz:
[b]Well, mine never broke, and having owned it for a year, and spent actual time talking with other owners in person and online, I sure didn't read about them breaking their Wranglers either.....
I don't havta read about it. I see them on the trails.

If you do trails like Engineer pass they're fine. But anything difficult will snap those axles in a NY minute.[/b]
So your stock axles are stronger than the stock Dana 44s on the Wrangler Rubicon? These are also available on all Wranglers, right from the dealership with full warranties.[/b]
Yes, my 33 spline 9.25" R&P axle (4.90 gears) is stronger than a Dana 44. D44 is still a decent axle, tho.

----

Porsche:

While we're on the subject of XJ's.

They're nice cuz they're light, but I've seen suspension compnents ripped right off that wimpy unibody. The unibody also flexes like a mofo under articulation. Sometimes it seem like the windows are about to "pop".

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#212710 - 17/10/05 01:46 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


My biggest point is, an offroad rig is only as good as you build it. Stock vehicles simply cannot complete the most difficult trails. Even a rubi doesn't have enough ground clearance to really get over big stuff.

I have an essentially stock Xterra that I have beaten the sh!t out of and it's still going.

There are lots of good options for Xterras for those who want to build them.

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#212711 - 17/10/05 02:32 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Chris Mc Offline
Member

Registered: 16/11/00
Posts: 1535
Loc: St Charles, MO
If you put equal dollars into an Xterra and a Rubi, the Rubi will whoop ass. No doubt about it. How much $$ (total, tires et al) is a SAS for an X? Do you realize how many mods you can do to a Rubi for that amount?

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#212712 - 17/10/05 04:06 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


jeep has been around for what 50 years, it damn well have better aftermarket support than a vehicle thats been on the market for only 6 years. xterra is in it infancy as far as parts. as it should be.

jeeps are jeeps not suv's, that term hasnt even been around long enough for a jeep to be classified as an suv.

the jeep was concieved as a vehicle for ruff terrain, the xterra was designed to go from on road to offroad.

all in all you cannot compare the 2 with each other, it would be like comparing a corvette with an escort. :rolleyes:

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#212713 - 17/10/05 04:20 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


I would imagine that any unbiased person would realize that he's wrong when the claims he is making about the X are overwhelmingly refuted by other X Owners. No offense, but we're not in the business of putting down our own trucks. You simply leave us no choice.

Here's what we're going to do:

1. Order the following catalogs (They are free)
http://www.quadratec.com/cgi-bin/sgdynamo.exe?HTNAME=freecatalog.html
http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/stor...catalogId=10101
http://www.acmejeepparts.com/cgi-bin/sgdynamo.exe?HTNAME=acmecatalog.html
http://www.4wd.com/ordercatalog/

2. Take a day off of work (you'll need it).

3. Read to your heart's content (the first catalog is over 300 pages)

4. Come back here and we'll discuss the Jeep aftermarket.

BTW..If you can send me a link to a Xterra catalog, I'll be more than happy to order it. I've been looking everywhere and you obviously have a source I don't know about smile

....Until then...I'm signing off.

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#212714 - 17/10/05 04:30 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:

Maybe you should read the TOPIC again. Wrangler vs. Xterra.
i took your advice and re-read the title and realized that maybe you are the one that should be taking your advice, cause that is not what the topic title is. laugh

btw any one can post pics of any offroad vehicle in fucked up situations. laugh

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#212715 - 17/10/05 04:32 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by Adrian:
I would imagine that any unbiased person would realize that he's wrong when the claims he is making about the X are overwhelmingly refuted by other X Owners. No offense, but we're not in the business of putting down our own trucks. You simply leave us no choice.

Here's what we're going to do:

1. Order the following catalogs (They are free)
http://www.quadratec.com/cgi-bin/sgdynamo.exe?HTNAME=freecatalog.html
http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/stor...catalogId=10101
http://www.acmejeepparts.com/cgi-bin/sgdynamo.exe?HTNAME=acmecatalog.html
http://www.4wd.com/ordercatalog/

2. Take a day off of work (you'll need it).

3. Read to your heart's content (the first catalog is over 300 pages)

4. Come back here and we'll discuss the Jeep aftermarket.

BTW..If you can send me a link to a Xterra catalog, I'll be more than happy to order it. I've been looking everywhere and you obviously have a source I don't know about smile

....Until then...I'm signing off.
jeep has been around for what 50 years, it damn well have better aftermarket support .

i thought i already said that

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#212716 - 17/10/05 04:35 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


my idea,

if you want an x go to an X related club.
if you want a jeep then go to a jeep related club.

everyone buy what you want and have a nice big fat glass of STFU.

has any one started this same topic on a jeepers board to see what kinda shit it starts there too.

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#212717 - 17/10/05 04:41 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by Chris Mc:
If you put equal dollars into an Xterra and a Rubi, the Rubi will whoop ass. No doubt about it. How much $$ (total, tires et al) is a SAS for an X? Do you realize how many mods you can do to a Rubi for that amount?
This is the kind of statement I can comment on. You're 98% wrong. Why not 99? Because I give the credit where it's due to the Rubi's (in all seriousness). Recognize Chris Mc, the highly modded X vs highly modded Rubi is hardly different.

The thread wasn't meant for Stock vs Stock of each sort specifically...nor was it meant to discuss Highly modded vs Highly modded of each vehicle specifically. We're talking about the entire spectrum of the argument.

*although, ultimately we should be talking about average costs of the folks that mod at a high level, but not the folks that could make their X an 18 wheeler with a BBQ grill and a pool on the back because money is not an issue*

Wheelbase is really the major difference, other than torque/power. Another major difference, which i think i've mentioned before, is where the electronics are built on a jeep.

Basically, I could go on forever... but to avoid that, I'll just stop at you're plain wrong (not to be a dick man), but I'm a newbie and it's obvious that each vehicle are amazing offroad beasts.

Now, let's stop getting all
[Argue] <------ and ------> [Finger]
and get a little more [Smoking] .

Let's make valid statements and arguments, all while learning. This thread has probably taught me more than any other on the stuff I'm all about knowing. This forum rules.

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#212718 - 17/10/05 04:50 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Xtoolbox Offline
Member

Registered: 23/08/00
Posts: 1668
Loc: Torrance, CA
Quote:
Originally posted by Chris Mc:
If you put equal dollars into an Xterra and a Rubi, the Rubi will whoop ass. No doubt about it. How much $$ (total, tires et al) is a SAS for an X? Do you realize how many mods you can do to a Rubi for that amount?
I dunno about that, your 04 was what 24k+ ? Then add other 6k for the long-arm kit, steering, skids, drive shafts, bumpers, tires, etc and all of sudden you have 30k+ invested. I have around 35% of that invested into my dual locked 2k SAS X on 34s.

Even if I were to buy used like I did with my X, stock rubis are like 16-17k and modified ones likes Neds old one go for 21k which is still double what I have spent. Plus then you dont have the fun of actually building something as much or driving something that is more unique laugh

Getting back on topic [LOL] the X does have a fair amount of weight, sheet metal, glass, etc exposed and up high for the tighter canyon trails and whatnot. The SWBs without the tops all this stuff tend to have a easier time. Not to mention the interior cages and options.

Hum, whos going to have the 1st full-on tube cage on a X? [Roll, fenders, engine, rear quarters, etc]
_________________________
SCCX Home Page

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#212719 - 17/10/05 06:10 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Hum, whos going to have the 1st full-on tube cage on a X? [Roll, fenders, engine, rear quarters, etc]
The way things are tearing on mine, it's crossed my mind before :rolleyes:
Throw one of these on there..

Of course, I'd have to keep my roof rack laugh

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#212720 - 17/10/05 06:13 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by Adrian:
I would imagine that any unbiased person would realize that.......
????

Jeeps(CJ/YJ/TJ) have the best aftermarket support. I never disputed that.

Why don't you try reading the post your replying to instead of perpetuating miscommunication.

Just because you're too much of a primadonna to take your X offroad, doesn't mean that other people don't...

I will repeat for the FOURTH time:

The Xterra has the best aftermarket support of any mid-sized/compact SUV on the market.

I never said I was unbiased, btw.

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#212721 - 17/10/05 08:16 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by JeffW:
Quote:
Originally posted by Adrian:
[b]I would imagine that any unbiased person would realize that.......
????

Jeeps(CJ/YJ/TJ) have the best aftermarket support. I never disputed that.

Why don't you try reading the post you're replying to instead of perpetuating miscommunication.
[/b]
You DID dispute this fact and there are 10 pages of useless posts from you to prove it. Here's what you said on page 7:

Quote:

Xterra probably has the largest (offroad) aftermarket of any SUV currently on the market. If you are having trouble getting stuff, it's because your vehicle hasn't been out a year yet.
And on page 9:

Quote:

The Xterra has the best offroading aftermarket of any current model SUV. That's what I said; that's what I meant.
Please go back and read your posts as you seem to have forgotten your own arguments.

On the other hand, I'm glad that you've finally come to your senses (at least partially).

Quote:

Just because you're too much of a primadonna to take your X offroad, doesn't mean that other people don't...

I will repeat for the FOURTH time:

The Xterra has the best aftermarket support of any mid-sized/compact SUV on the market.

I never said I was unbiased, btw.
Ok, so now you're saying 2 opposite things in the SAME post. You can't admit that, in your own words, "Jeeps(CJ/YJ/TJ) have the best aftermarket support," and then claim that the Xterra has the most support at the same time. It's either one or the other. BTW, you can add the Liberty, the Cherokee, and possibly the Grand Cherokee to that list.

Anyway, the X has has enough for most off-roading needs. As I have already told you (amnesia again?), I do off-road. I bought my X for off-roading and intend to go as often as possible. I actually did a bit off-roading with the salesman before I bought the X (scared the shit out of him) and went off-roading the day after buying it (even got a flat tire...there's a post somewhere about it). I have Shrock sliders and the bumper on order.

I would like to get some more things for my truck but you still haven't posted the site where I can get that Xterra catalog with all the many aftermarket accessories you seem to think are out there. Link Please!?!

In the meantime, Please order the Jeep catalogs. I went to the trouble of finding them for you and they are free. You will find out that, even though the CJ/YJ/TJ have the most support, ALL jeeps are supported.

Thanks a bunch...

By the way, here is the definition of primadonna. Go read it and I can guarantee it will make you feel all tingly inside. [Rainbow]

laugh

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#212722 - 17/10/05 08:34 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


yo! ADRIAAAAN!!!!!!!!!!!

hey i think you missed the part about him saying "SUV" in most of his post, in no way shape or form did he ever say that the xterra had more support than a jeep...he said more than modern "SUV"s. see there goes that term again. say it with me "ESSSSS,uuuuuuuu,vvvvveeeee"

and for the last time im telling that a jeep is a jeep and not a fricken SUV... [Finger]

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#212723 - 17/10/05 08:40 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


and since your so much into definitions here are 2 more for you:

Main Entry: 1jeep
Pronunciation: 'jEp
Function: noun
Etymology: probably from g. p. (abbreviation of general purpose)
: a small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80-inch wheelbase, 1/4-ton capacity, and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II; also : a similar but larger and more powerful U.S. army vehicle.

Main Entry: sport-utility vehicle
Pronunciation: 'spOrt-y-'ti-l&-tE-, 'sport-
Function: noun
: a rugged automotive vehicle similar to a station wagon but built on a light-truck chassis.

[Wave]

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#212724 - 17/10/05 09:45 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Jeff, STFU, you are embarrassing the rest of us...

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#212725 - 17/10/05 10:34 PM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by steelX:
and since your so much into definitions here are 2 more for you:

Main Entry: 1jeep
Pronunciation: 'jEp
Function: noun
Etymology: probably from g. p. (abbreviation of general purpose)
: a small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80-inch wheelbase, 1/4-ton capacity, and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II; also : a similar but larger and more powerful U.S. army vehicle.

Main Entry: sport-utility vehicle
Pronunciation: 'spOrt-y-'ti-l&-tE-, 'sport-
Function: noun
: a rugged automotive vehicle similar to a station wagon but built on a light-truck chassis.

[Wave]
Yo Clueless!

We're not talking about the Jeep as an Army vehicle. We're talking about a civilian vehicle; so find an appropriate definition. Since you can't seem to put 2 and 2 together, I did a little research for you:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compact_SUV
http://www.answers.com/topic/sport-utility-vehicle

And here are some examples of actual usage:

http://auto.consumerguide.com/auto/new/reviews/full/index.cfm/id/38720/
http://www.automotive.com/new-cars/pricing/05/suvs/jeep/
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2006/jeep/wrangler/suv/compact/index.html
http://autos.msn.com/advice/article.aspx?contentid=2906
http://www.roadandtravel.com/roadtests/buyersguides/2003buyersguide/sportcute/2003sportcute.htm
http://www.consumerreports.org/main/content/display_report.jsp?FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=772771&ASSORTMENT%3C%3East_id=389451
http://spyphotos.autoblog.com/entry/1234000270053527/

In fact, to be completely honest, I couldn't find a single automotive related website that didn't say the Wrangler is either a "small" or "compact" SUV. I don't know where you got the idea that the Wrangler is not an SUV, but all of the automotive sites on the internet disagree with you.

Bottom line: Jeff either can't figure out his terminology, or he's got a severe case of alzheimer's. He made 2 completely opposite claims in the same post. Trying to help him out by making more bogus claims does not add anything of value to this discussion.

[Wave]

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#212726 - 18/10/05 07:06 AM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by steelX:


btw any one can post pics of any offroad vehicle in fucked up situations.
EXACTLY. If you see the picture posted in the response before mine of the Jeep upside down, you'll understand why I posted a pic of an upside down Xterra. Hey, 1 point to you... you actually got it. wink

FWIW, the new 2005 longer Xterra has a wheelbase of 106.3 inches. That's 2" longer than the previous model. The Wrangler Unlimited has a wheelbase of 103 inches. Gee, 106" or 104" (depending on which year Xterra) vs 103". If you're in an area that LWB is an advantage, there is a LWB model Wrangler (even in Rubicon trim) available. The longer wheelbase discussion is hereby ended. [Finger]

Anybody have a link to the Xterra accessory catalog? I'm still waiting for it too.

Some of you are obviously new to owning a Nissan. I never found many accessories for my new 1995 Nissan P/up or my new 2000 Nissan Crew Cab.

FWIW, I was the first to post online (my website) how to find which air shocks would fit the Crew Cab. No shock manufacturers were supporting this model, even years after it first came out. I contacted the various companies, and none could help out. I was also the first person to add a Snugtop topper to their Crew Cab that had roof rails. I spent several weeks working with the company. The company took pictures of my truck during the install. Face it, Nissan keeps changing the models drastically every few years, so the aftermarket will NEVER have a big offering of accessories for YOUR model.

The great part is Nissan keeps improving their trucks (which is why I keep buying them), the downside is aftermarket companies aren't going to invest a lot of time & money for a niche market.

Somebody mentioned Jeep has been around for 50 years. Close, it's actually 60 years. That's just the civilian market. Made even earlier for the Military. The CJ-5 (1979 Model) body design was almost unchanged for 29 years. History lesson here: Link.

Don't hold your breath waiting for the aftermarket to suddenly offer tons of goodies. Ain't gonna happen. In a couple of years, if Nissan holds true to form, they'll change the model once again. The bad part for me is I seem to be on a 5 year buying cycle for Nissans... eek laugh

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#212727 - 18/10/05 07:45 AM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Right on 2manytoys!

I love the X. I have the sliders now, and once I get the bumper and a lift, I think I'll be happy from the offroading standpoint. Would it be cool to have a bunch of other options for each of these items plus a lot of other things? Yes! Is it likely to happen? NO!

What these guys have to understand is that the fact that Jeeps have more support dosen't take anything away from our Xs. The X is still an awesome vehicle that is better than the Jeep in many ways (but not in all ways). Why can't we be happy with what we have without putting down someone's else's ride?

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#212728 - 18/10/05 08:24 AM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by steelX:
and since your so much into definitions here are 2 more for you:

Main Entry: 1jeep
Pronunciation: 'jEp
Function: noun
Etymology: probably from g. p. (abbreviation of general purpose)
: a small general-purpose motor vehicle with 80-inch wheelbase, 1/4-ton capacity, and four-wheel drive used by the U.S. army in World War II; also : a similar but larger and more powerful U.S. army vehicle.

Main Entry: sport-utility vehicle
Pronunciation: 'spOrt-y-'ti-l&-tE-, 'sport-
Function: noun
: a rugged automotive vehicle similar to a station wagon but built on a light-truck chassis.

[Wave]
Exactly! That's why Car & Driver and Motor Trend don't do comparative road tests between ANY 4-Door SUV and the Wrangler. The Wrangler is not an SUV and most people don't refer to it as such. Even though the wikipedia page features a picture of a Wrangler, it's definition is contrary to that:

Quote:
sport utility vehicle

A sport utility vehicle (SUV) or off-roader is a type of passenger vehicle which combines the load-hauling and passenger-carrying capacity of a large station wagon or minivan with features designed for off-road driving.
Regardless of what someone's interpretation of SUV, I know enough to determine that an Xterra is a better trail rig for me. I keep listing the reasons, but all of the Jeep whores who never wheel keep "sucking off" the Wrangler.

You keep twisting my words, but if you go back you will see that everything I have said is true.

Jeeps are fine. But they require a lotta $$$ to become real hardcore rigs. Somebody who owns a modded Jeep is nothing special as they are ubiquitous.

I wheel with both Yotas and Jeeps. We all agree with one thing. The Xterra is the only new SUV worth modding.

Quote:
Originally posted by ChefTyler:
Jeff, STFU, you are embarrassing the rest of us...
Sorry, Ty. I don't take orders from people who live in fear of embarassment.....

Quote:
Originally posted by Adrian:
Quote:
Originally posted by JeffW:
[b]
Quote:
Originally posted by Adrian:
[b]I would imagine that any unbiased person would realize that.......
????

Jeeps(CJ/YJ/TJ) have the best aftermarket support. I never disputed that.....[/b]
You DID.....[/b]
I disagree with everything except the color of your Xterra! laugh

Quote:
Originally posted by Xtoolbox:
Quote:
Originally posted by Chris Mc:
[b]If you put equal dollars into an Xterra and a Rubi, the Rubi will......
.....Even if I were to buy used like I did with my X, stock rubis are like 16-17k and modified ones likes Neds old one go for 21k which is still double what I have spent. Plus then you dont have the fun of actually building something as much or driving something that is more unique laugh ......[/b]
Jeeps, like Xterras need mods. It's all about how much of a sheep (or not) you want to be.

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#212729 - 18/10/05 09:51 AM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Come on, JeffW... You've got to admit. This is one "unique" Jeep...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Jeep-Gran...bayphotohosting

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#212730 - 18/10/05 09:55 AM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by porsche996:
[QB]Come on, JeffW... You've got to admit. This is one "unique" Jeep...

ht tp://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Jeep-Gra...bayphotohosting [/QB ]
LMFAO!

Let me see if he'll take my X on trade! [Too much XOC]


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#212731 - 18/10/05 09:57 AM Re: Ok. Wrangler or Xterra?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by JeffW:
[Regardless of what someone's interpretation of SUV, I know enough to determine that an Xterra is a better trail rig for me. I keep listing the reasons, but all of the Jeep whores who never wheel keep "sucking off" the Wrangler.
Who's the Jeep whore who never wheels? Me? Think not. Read again where I've been. I started off-roading in my '73 Chevy Luv (Isuzu) and my buddy had a Datsun (aka: Nissan).



I was getting my vehicle stuck in the woods back before you got zits. :p

Quote:

Jeeps are fine. But they require a lotta $$$ to become real hardcore rigs.
So? But the point is they CAN be modified EASILY, and for far less money than the Xterra. And there isn't a single Xterra out there that's in the same category as a highly modified Jeep.

Jeeps come with roll bars and steel bumpers. Winches are bolt-on. If it flips over on its side, the damage is FAR less than it would be on the Xterra. The Jeep isn't water sensitive like the Xterra is. Those are facts. That doesn't take away from the Xterra being a great trail rig. Just a different classification. Either, in stock trim, will go on "most" trails.

Quote:

Somebody who owns a modded Jeep is nothing special as they are ubiquitous.
No argument there. But there's a reason why there are so many modified Jeeps. They can be, done so inexpensively by comparison, and it's easy to do.

Quote:
I wheel with both Yotas and Jeeps. We all agree with one thing. The Xterra is the only new SUV worth modding.
Again, no argument. Unfortunately, none of my buddies around here own Xterras. Maybe mine will earn respect in time with my crew. I'm planning a hunting trip and some general off-roading/plinking trips shortly...

Quote:
Jeeps, like Xterras need mods. It's all about how much of a sheep (or not) you want to be.
That's not what it's all about. Its about availability and cost... and untimately what you can end up with.

Face it, nobody on this forum bought an Xterra for extreme off-roading. There are several reasons for that. But that doesn't take away from the Xterra. The Jeep was designed for the trail. It was from the beginning. It was a tough transistion to convert it into a decent daily driver. But Jeep did accomplish that when they switched over to coil springs in 1997. Despite what some think, my 2004 Sahara was a good daily driver. 32K in 1 year gives you an idea that I spent some time actually driving it. I also towed it a couple of thousand miles, and those miles don't show up on the odometer. The first week I owned it, I drove it through 3' deep swamp water.

The Xterra is a better choice for me. I drive on mild to very moderate trails these days. I didn't always. I wouldn't risk damage to my Xterra by driving in deep water like I did my Jeep. While you may think off-roading in FL is nothing more than sandy trails... some of us know better. I've been in your neck of the woods a few times. Give me a shout when you come this way. I'll set up up with a buddy I've been wheelin' with when I had my Jeep. You can play follow the leader with him. I'll bring the camera. I'll buy you a steak dinner if you don't get stuck... I'll buy him one if you do. wink

Hey, enjoy what you drive.

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