Why do so many people talk about BFG AT's and MT's like God molds them himself. BFG's are middle of the road at best. The "3rd" layer of sidewall is not going to save you if your railing it with a rock or root. How thick do you think it is?
Better tires in the mud:
1. Swampers & Boggers
2. Mickey Thompson claws
3. Parnelli Jones dirt grip.
4. Uniroyal Laredo M/T's.
5. Yokohama Geolander M/T's
6. Big O m/t
7. ground hawgs
8. gumbo mudders.
9. General M/T's
My theory on "All" terrains:
Mud tires work on the street, but street tires (AT's) don't work in the mud.
This isn't about MT's vs. AT's, it's about -BFG's ain't all that; damn.

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'01 Yellow SE 4X4 w/leather, stock so far.
'96 Dodge Ram 4x4, 318ci, 5spd., 33X12.5 Mickey Thompson Baja Claw Radials, 3.92 gears True-trac LSD front axle, Auburn LSD rear axle.

Okay, but why are you comparing bias ply tires (most Swampers, some Mickey Thompson's, and if I'm not mistaken, the Parnelli Jones) with radials? That seems like an inappropriate comparison, especially considering 99% of the people who offroad on this board use their X as their daily driver.

I would argue my BFG AT's work better in the mud than my Swampers do on the street. Sure, you can run anything you want to, but the fact remains that for most people who offroad their daily driver, all terrain tires make more sense than mud terrains. That having been said, the BFG's work well offroad, are relatively quiet, last a long time, and have much better street manners than most of the tires you list (both BFG's, ATs and MTs.) Hell yes, if we were all wheeling trailer queens I'd agree with you, but as it is I think the BFG's are a pretty damn good choice.

[edit]Reduced the flame quantity.

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Vikram/gothamist -- MAXC member
http://www.4x4LO.com

[This message has been edited by gothamist (edited 03-19-2001).]

I'm saying: If your going to put up with the draw backs of mud tires, go ahead and get a MUD tire. There are much better choices out there. It's just too many people can't see past BFG's colorful ads. It's very sad to see 4 wheel drive lemmings following each other to their muddy doom.
I'm not talking bias, belted or radial; I'm talking tread design/shape.
As far as being an expert, I have three 4x4's sitting outside. From a fully ARB locked CJ-8 to a stock Xterra. I have never not had a 4x4 and have purchased and used almost all models of mud tires and a lot of all terrains. I've Off-roaded at 13,000 feet in the San Juan mtns. to miles of coastal salt marshes. When people leave my driveway most people opt to engage 4wd if they have it. UPS hates me. I don't know what the definition of an expert is, but I would say I'm am extremely experienced.
Before you spend $500-$1000, do some research; the most popular isn't always best.
But hey, I am with you on the light fetish. You can never have enough candle power.

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'01 Yellow SE 4X4 w/leather, stock so far.
'96 Dodge Ram 4x4, 318ci, 5spd., 33X12.5 Mickey Thompson Baja Claw Radials, 3.92 gears True-trac LSD front axle, Auburn LSD rear axle.

Okay, I see your point better now. What you're saying makes more sense, but I'm still not in 100% agreement with you--I think the BFG muds are a great choice for people who don't want the noise and terrible onroad handling characteristics of a lot of the far more aggressive mud tires you listed. They also *do* work offroad, I am routinely impressed with the BFG MT's on Synchro's and Philosopher's trucks, especially when I used to compare them to my BFG ATs.

The one tire you list on there that I'm surprised no one really talks about much is the Yokohama, it seems to be the most direct comparison to the BFG MTs, and I've only heard good things about them. Only seen them mounted up on one truck in person, though.

I must admit I'm not that familiar with the Uniroyals or the Generals...I don't read any of the 4x4 magazines (they all read like ad copy to me), so I really only have an idea concerning tires I've seen on the trail or talked about with people who run them.

p.s. re: lights...right on, I agree...unfortunately you can have too many amps draw on your alternator...oy!

[edit]Because sometimes I can't spell...

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Vikram/gothamist -- MAXC member
http://www.4x4LO.com

[This message has been edited by gothamist (edited 03-19-2001).]

Did you ever think that people run BFG's becuase they LIKE them? They are all around great tires. If you want to run something else, do so.

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:wq!
wqbang@southeastxterraclub.org

Actually the Uniroyal M/T's are one of my favorite tires. I went to them right after a set of TSL's. They seemed to perform almost as good, you just had to spin them a little faster to get them clean. I ended up going through two sets of them. They lasted about 40K miles, were very quiet and tracked straight. For some reason you never see any ads for them, and the dealer always has to order them. Try this link. http://www.uniroyal.com/prod_la_fr.htm
Well the link will get you close, you still have to click on the icon.
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'01 Yellow SE 4X4 w/leather, stock so far.
'96 Dodge Ram 4x4, 318ci, 5spd., 33X12.5 Mickey Thompson Baja Claw Radials, 3.92 gears True-trac LSD front axle, Auburn LSD rear axle.

[This message has been edited by seamonkey (edited 03-20-2001).]

Uh, Boggers are Swampers.




Ground Hawgs belong much higher on the list than #7!

Also, no Mud Terrain tire whether it be BFG MTs or Big-O MTs are very good in the mud. Yeah, they're better than the Long Trails and ATs, but aren't designed for serious mud running. If you wanna play in the mud, you get Swampers.

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Michael Girardo
Member - MAXC | Moderator - XOC
www.avaloninternet.net/users/bythebay/xterra <---Redesigned

"Uh, Boggers are Swampers"
I'm refering to the two prelavent extreme mud tires that interco makes.
Super swamper TSL & Super Swamper TSL bogger (commonly referred to as just "bogger".)

The list is in no particular order.

A good thing about BFG's is when you do ruin one, everyone carries them in every size, so you can just run down and buy one. I usually have to run a spare until I can get one ordered.

I dont hate them its just seems like that the only name I hear when there are so many more choices. Its like at LS1.com (TransAms/z-28's), the only car wax is Zaino.

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'01 Yellow SE 4X4 w/leather, stock so far.
'96 Dodge Ram 4x4, 318ci, 5spd., 33X12.5 Mickey Thompson Baja Claw Radials, 3.92 gears True-trac LSD front axle, Auburn LSD rear axle.

I'm not crazy about BFG MT's. I agree there are better mudders, even better mudders that are better onroad too.

For AT's, a compromise tread more aggressive than an all season type tread, the BFG AT KO's are pretty good. 32 x 11.5's ran me $100 each for the AT KO.

I think the best tire for an individual depends upon the terrain mix expected. The fact that a particular mudder is king in actual deep slop won't help if you are doing rock crawling and highway.



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- TJ

2001 Xterra SE 5 Speed Gold Rush

The BFG MTs were a great first tire. I went off the recommendation of a friend, and they have done me REAL well, i really like them. no complaints here. but now thatI have more expereince, i am toying with the idea, that once my BFG MTs wear out, I am probably going to run some sort of 32x11.5R15 AT on the street and run 32x11.5R15 Swampers off-road. I'll just get an impact wrench and a power tank so i can swap out easily at home before going on a run and have use of it on the trail if need be. but this is a bit down the road.

the MTs suffice for the moment and i have other things i need to spend my cash on right now. did i mention my new Elinchrom photo studio set up?

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Synchro (aka Kirk)
synchro@xterraoffroad.com
2000 Xterra SE, Alpine Green, 4x4, ARB, 32" BFG MTs

[This message has been edited by Synchro (edited 03-20-2001).]

As a nice alternative, you all might check into the Pro-Comp line of tires.
http://www.4wheelparts.com/category.asp?cat=TIR

Or you can try their site at
http://www.explorerprocomp.com/

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-Carl
Silver XE 4x4
5-Speed