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#533322 - 16/05/07 06:31 AM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


I'm going to guess not. My dealer wouldn't even open up the diff case when my front blew. I think that comes down from corp to not open it and just replace the entire thing.

If I am not mistaken the guy with the Nismo Frontier had his rearend rebuilt on his own dime. Maybe he would know.

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#533323 - 16/05/07 07:56 AM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Hope to hear back from Nissan later, but there " 24hrs" is up. I wont be paying for this, even if I have to hire a lawyer. I hope we can find out if it is the 2 spider gear units letting go so fast. From what I can tell the 4 spider gears are also no good, but should last significantly longer.

I have a feeling I will get the " well, we are doing this only once" line as well. And with 30K of warranty left that is scarry. And what about if the front blows? Hmmmm.

On the positive side it sounds like Xterra Racer is working hard at an economical solution to fix these diffs. It is only a question of time and do we risk paying for a 3,500.00 diff out of pocket again or park our rigs until the upgrades come out? Sounds like something will be available soon, but I have a feeling it will be limited to protoype testing for little while.

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#533324 - 16/05/07 12:00 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by Muzikman:

If I am not mistaken the guy with the Nismo Frontier had his rearend rebuilt on his own dime. Maybe he would know.
They were trying to make me pay for it, but I eventually "persuaded" them to cover it under warranty for me and they put a whole new rear axle under there for me. Housing and everything. I didn't get to see if it was 2 or 4 though. I took a camera phone pic but you can't tell anything from it.

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#533325 - 16/05/07 12:02 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Ah, gotcha, I know when I left off on that thread over there you were talking about them just rebuilding it.

I'm going to have to go revisit that thread.

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#533326 - 16/05/07 12:25 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Somebody want to explain how a "2-spider gear" center differential works?? I've never seen one, and I'm having a hard time figuring out how only 2 gears can do the job.

Only design I've ever seen is 2 side spider gears & 2 un-attached spider gears, which makes differential rotation of the tires possible. I can't figure out how 2 spiders can be designed to do the job.

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#533327 - 16/05/07 12:33 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
BurgPath Offline
Member

Registered: 25/05/02
Posts: 2146
Loc: Knoxville, Tn
(side note)

Sorry about your truck man. I hope they take care of it for you. Time to trade in.
I love hearing the Titan horror stories. I'm swaying toward a Tundra right now, stories like this will keep me there. smile
_________________________
Kevin
- 2008.5 Titan SE 4x4
Burgy --- Nissan Offroad Association of the Southeast

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#533328 - 16/05/07 01:11 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Hmmm, I wonder if someone could get a schematic of the 2 spider gear diff. I cannot see how that would work either. Xterra Racer could maybe elaborate.

You know I LOVE my Titan, but it will be retired to construction duty soon at work and it will obviously need a differential fix. I snuck over to both the Titan and Frontier forums today, and moral is headed downhill for sure. This has really bummed me out. In the next 2 years I will most likely switch to Tundra. I hope Nissan will see the disaster brewing here, because I GUARENTEE the Tundra wont be getting a rep for blown diffs or anything of such on brand new trucks! Can you say 10.5" ring gear?

Again, I dont need a perfect vehicle. But catostrophic drivetrane failure without improvements....I mean the J/K quits running after 3-8K, but it is atleast an electronic issue that will soon be fixed permanently under warranty. We are stuck with diffs that will not allow us to tow or wheel without serious aftermarket support, and leave standing by the road. frown

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#533329 - 16/05/07 02:52 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Here is an animation of a standard (open) 2-spider differential. The vast majority of differentials in cars and small trucks are 2-spider. Open differential The spider gears are the red ones.

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#533330 - 16/05/07 03:01 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by GraniteX:
Here is an animation of a standard (open) 2-spider differential. The vast majority of differentials in cars and small trucks are 2-spider. Open differential The spider gears are the red ones.
You just posted a link to what's considered a normal spider gear setup, w/ 4 spider gears... The side gears and the pinion gears are collectively known as the "spider gears," so far as I know. I guess I could be wrong on the nomenclature, but if that's the case, then somebody's going to have to explain what a "4 spider gear" case looks like, 'cause there's no room for 4 of 'em.

Here's a nice photo of an open Dana 30:



The side gears & the pinion gears are the spider gears. There's not enough space to put 2 more of 'em in there, and it wouldn't work if you took 2 of 'em out.

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#533331 - 16/05/07 03:08 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


You are wrong. Here is an example of 4 spider conversion kit to upgrade a standard 2 spider differential. 4 Spider

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#533332 - 16/05/07 03:36 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Here is another picture and diagram of standard 2 spider diff. Note that the diagram below the picture is incorrectly labeled. The arrows in the diagram labeled "side gears" are really pointing to the spider gears. Differential I built high performance and off-road VW's in my past and a 4-spider upgrade was standard practice.

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#533333 - 16/05/07 03:46 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by RiNkY:
Here's mine. I don't know my ass from my elbow with regards to what I'm looking at tho and if I have 2 or 4 Spider gears.

REAR DIFF101
In this picture is a 4 spider diff. This is the factory elec. locker. Look to the left of the ring gear, notice the seam in the flange the ring gear bolts to? This is how the case opens to access the internals. When you remove the ring gear and 2 small screws and then she comes apart. Now on the right side notice the 2 white wires coming down into the black plastic block, this is the electric magnet, that locks the diff when given power. The magnet pushes a plate with fingers out to engage the locker.This model is the strongest Nissan currently offers. This is the one I run in my racer to date. The 2 spider will not make it 100 race miles. The weakest link in the 4 spider diff is the passenger axle end gear. It has been machined down to clear the magnet assembly. This made the splines that drive the axle too weak. Nissan does not sell the end gear separate. You must replace the complete rear axle assembly.

XterraRacer
TeamXterraRacing.com

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#533334 - 16/05/07 04:30 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Awesome - Nice to know I have the stronger version. Although it's the front I'm more concerned about. Roll on May 30th when my house closes and I get the cash to put into my indestructible 87 4Runner! smile

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#533335 - 16/05/07 04:34 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


I am getting close to having a spool for the Nissan M226 rear done.

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#533336 - 16/05/07 07:40 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


here is a great picture of a four spider gear locking rear diff from ARB.

ARB locker

the locker connects the the two axle gears together. when locked the spider gears do nothing. when unlocked the spider gears turn to alow the axles to spin at different speeds.

im assuming your rear diff was unlocked when it failed?

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#533337 - 16/05/07 07:56 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Here is another picture and diagram of standard 2 spider diff. Note that the diagram below the picture is incorrectly labeled. The arrows in the diagram labeled "side gears" are really pointing to the spider gears. Differential I built high performance and off-road VW's in my past and a 4-spider upgrade was standard practice.
actually the label to the side gears are not spider gears. they are infact side gears (not sure what or if they have a "technical" name). they connect directly to the axle and spin on one axis through the center of the axle/gear.

spider gears rotate on two axis', one through the gear that is perpendicular to the axis and on an axis through the middle of the axle.

im not an expert on this but as far as i know this is right.

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#533338 - 16/05/07 08:58 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


is this just an 05 deal??

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#533339 - 16/05/07 09:05 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Sorry, It is a problem that is inhierent to some 2nd generation Xterras and Fronteirs, even the Titans. Anything with the M226 Dana axle.

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#533340 - 16/05/07 10:55 PM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


So we just have to wait and see if it goes or not?? man that's not cool!!!

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#533341 - 17/05/07 06:03 AM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by xterraracer:
Quote:
Originally posted by RiNkY:
[b]Here's mine. I don't know my ass from my elbow with regards to what I'm looking at tho and if I have 2 or 4 Spider gears.

REAR DIFF101
In this picture is a 4 spider diff. This is the factory elec. locker. Look to the left of the ring gear, notice the seam in the flange the ring gear bolts to? This is how the case opens to access the internals. When you remove the ring gear and 2 small screws and then she comes apart. Now on the right side notice the 2 white wires coming down into the black plastic block, this is the electric magnet, that locks the diff when given power. The magnet pushes a plate with fingers out to engage the locker.This model is the strongest Nissan currently offers. This is the one I run in my racer to date. The 2 spider will not make it 100 race miles. The weakest link in the 4 spider diff is the passenger axle end gear. It has been machined down to clear the magnet assembly. This made the splines that drive the axle too weak. Nissan does not sell the end gear separate. You must replace the complete rear axle assembly.

XterraRacer
TeamXterraRacing.com [/b]
So all OR models (they all have the factory locker) are the same? That's not good to know as that's what we have seen fail recently (the M226 w/ E-Locker).

If the passanger side side gear is infact the weak point, that's what sounds like Lloyd blew. Blowing the side gear would act the same as blowing the spider gears.

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#533342 - 17/05/07 06:05 AM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by porsche996:
Quote:
Originally posted by GraniteX:
[b]Here is an animation of a standard (open) 2-spider differential. The vast majority of differentials in cars and small trucks are 2-spider. Open differential The spider gears are the red ones.
You just posted a link to what's considered a normal spider gear setup, w/ 4 spider gears... The side gears and the pinion gears are collectively known as the "spider gears," so far as I know. I guess I could be wrong on the nomenclature, but if that's the case, then somebody's going to have to explain what a "4 spider gear" case looks like, 'cause there's no room for 4 of 'em.

Here's a nice photo of an open Dana 30:



The side gears & the pinion gears are the spider gears. There's not enough space to put 2 more of 'em in there, and it wouldn't work if you took 2 of 'em out.[/b]
As someone already pointed out...that is a 2 spider diff. That diff has two side gears (where the axle shaft attaches) and two spider gears.

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#533343 - 17/05/07 06:10 AM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by Muzikman:
As someone already pointed out...that is a 2 spider diff. That diff has two side gears (where the axle shaft attaches) and two spider gears.
Got the message the first time...

[ThumbsUp]

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#533344 - 17/05/07 06:32 AM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Some lacky at Nissan customer service, not even someone that knows anything about these trucks denied the warranty. So, I will be hiring and attorney, going to war, and spreading the word about Nissan as much as I can. I am going to pay to have that POS towed back to my house for now and preserve evidence.

Guess I am done wheeling for now. Then trade in on something else later. Glad I did not buy those 2 new Titan work trucks yet!

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#533345 - 17/05/07 07:28 AM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
Anonymous
Unregistered


Lloyd, I'm sorry you've had a terrible experience with Nissan. Nissan of just 3 years ago did not have this type of problem; I have yet to hear of anyone destroying an H233B rear differential. The newer vehicles Nissan has been putting out in the past few years have been geared towards the majority, and not the wheeling minority. Unfortunately, it's created rigs that do great on pavement, but are severely lacking in strength offroad, or for heavy duty work. It's unfortunate, but it's been working for Nissan on the sales end, so I don't see them changing their target audience in the future.

You'll probably get bashed for saying negatives about Nissan around here, so please, do yourself a favor and keep any negatives to the 05+ models, as the previous models do not suffer from this weak condition!

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#533346 - 17/05/07 07:33 AM Re: Add my Rear Diff to the collection
BurgPath Offline
Member

Registered: 25/05/02
Posts: 2146
Loc: Knoxville, Tn
Quote:
Originally posted by Lloyd Swartz:
Some lacky at Nissan customer service, not even someone that knows anything about these trucks denied the warranty. So, I will be hiring and attorney, going to war, and spreading the word about Nissan as much as I can. I am going to pay to have that POS towed back to my house for now and preserve evidence.

Guess I am done wheeling for now. Then trade in on something else later. Glad I did not buy those 2 new Titan work trucks yet!
Good luck. I hope thye take care of it like they should.
_________________________
Kevin
- 2008.5 Titan SE 4x4
Burgy --- Nissan Offroad Association of the Southeast

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