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#617825 - 02/01/07 02:20 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
TJ Offline
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Registered: 08/03/01
Posts: 7756
Loc: Lawrenceville, NJ, USA
Side note...

I do spin control for some clients, and one of the things I advise is to NOT throw charts at people, as despite their factual weight and clearness of case, etc...the average person perceives them as chicken scratch, or a foreign language...

Typically, analogies work most of the time, avoiding technobabble.

On this thread...we have analogy after analogy, equation after equation...and the dog is still looking at the finger instead of where its pointing to.

laugh
_________________________
- TJ

2001 Xterra '03 VG33, SE 5 spd, 305/70/16's, Revolvers, UBSkidderz, Doubled AAL's, 3"SL/2"BL, winch/bumpers, skids, sliders, OBA, Snorkel, pine stripes....

Friends don't let friends drive stock.

http://www.gifsoup.com/view/501230/tj-tackling-crawlers-ridge-o.gif

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#617826 - 02/01/07 02:26 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Anonymous
Unregistered


Oops. Forgot to add another reason I'd go out the side door instead of the rear.

Railroad ties aren't very good on ankles... I'd rather scratch up my leg on the brush than twist and/or break an ankle on a railroad tie... No thank you. Not to mention the very real possibility of hopping off the back, stepping down ackward, and smacking my face on an extremely hot and extremely hard railroad track!

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#617827 - 02/01/07 02:36 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
XPLORx4 Offline
Member

Registered: 23/03/01
Posts: 1906
Loc: San Jose, CA
Who said there was brush along the sides of the tracks? [Finger]
_________________________
4x4 in uppercase is $X$!!!
1997 R50: VG33E/RE4R01A/TX10/3.7/R200A/ARB/4.636/H233B/ARB/4.636/321150R15

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#617828 - 02/01/07 02:37 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by Trihead:
12mph is what 5 min per mile, I am guessing there isn't anyone on the this board running sub 5's.
I used to be able to run a 5 minute mile. I can still run a 7 minute mile though. But this is for a short burst. I was a sprinter in high school. Used to be able to run 200m in 23 seconds. That's what....1600m in 184 seconds or a mile in 3 minutes 4 seconds which is approximately 19 mph... Granted, I couldn't keep that pace for a whole mile if I had to, but for short distances I could do it with no problem...

That being said, I'd hang out the side, get up to speed with the train and slow at my own pace once I let go of the train....

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#617829 - 02/01/07 02:44 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Anonymous
Unregistered


TJ, JeffW and porsche996 all agree on this one....

S-C-A-R-Y

[Uh Oh !]


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#617830 - 02/01/07 02:44 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
TJ Offline
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Registered: 08/03/01
Posts: 7756
Loc: Lawrenceville, NJ, USA
I don't suppose anyone tried the emergency brakes?

laugh
_________________________
- TJ

2001 Xterra '03 VG33, SE 5 spd, 305/70/16's, Revolvers, UBSkidderz, Doubled AAL's, 3"SL/2"BL, winch/bumpers, skids, sliders, OBA, Snorkel, pine stripes....

Friends don't let friends drive stock.

http://www.gifsoup.com/view/501230/tj-tackling-crawlers-ridge-o.gif

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#617831 - 02/01/07 02:46 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
TJ Offline
Member
*****

Registered: 08/03/01
Posts: 7756
Loc: Lawrenceville, NJ, USA
Quote:
Originally posted by JeffW:
TJ, JeffW and porsche996 all agree on this one....

S-C-A-R-Y

[Uh Oh !]

[Shudder] Urban sprawl [/Shudder]
_________________________
- TJ

2001 Xterra '03 VG33, SE 5 spd, 305/70/16's, Revolvers, UBSkidderz, Doubled AAL's, 3"SL/2"BL, winch/bumpers, skids, sliders, OBA, Snorkel, pine stripes....

Friends don't let friends drive stock.

http://www.gifsoup.com/view/501230/tj-tackling-crawlers-ridge-o.gif

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#617832 - 02/01/07 02:59 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Paul H Offline
Member

Registered: 23/08/01
Posts: 4757
Loc: Mt. Zion, IL
Quote:
Originally posted by JeffW:
TJ, JeffW and porsche996 all agree on this one....

S-C-A-R-Y

[Uh Oh !]

Yet Jeff still was the only dick about it until Randall came in. [Huh?]

I am still of the middle. No one here has absolutely convinced me it will 100% every time take off. To much variables not explained in the scenario. I am not 100% convinced it would stay on the ground either.

I am of the wheels blow up or wheel bearing melts runway run out of room type of guy. I know the plane will move but will the conveyor give enough counter friction to mess up the flight. Depends on me the size of plane and runway which is not laid out.

Small plane long runway I am of the fly theory.

Big plane small runway (small yet large enough for the big plane to take off under normal circumstances) no fly.

That is my opinion.

Jeff you cannot prove you are 100% right. I agree the plane moves. So shut up about how it moves. I am tired of seeing someone else's work in your argument.
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#617833 - 02/01/07 04:14 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
TJ Offline
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Registered: 08/03/01
Posts: 7756
Loc: Lawrenceville, NJ, USA
Interesting...so the only remaining reservations come down to:

1. If the plane's wheels can freely rotate against nothing but the normal resistance of their own bearings at double the minimal take off speed w/o over heating and shear welding, etc...before the plane can take off..

and

2. The plane's tires will similarly survive long enough to allow take off, despite double the minimum take off speed.

While beyond the apparent scope of the problem's given...its at least something that is potentially able to be confirmed....if we knew the weight of the plane, its minimum take off speed, its appropriate take off distance, and the specs for its tires, and so forth....

I'm pretty sure that these parameters are well beyond the scope of the simple logic test...and, I'm sure...NOT intended to be part of the question...as, if it were, they could simply say its a Boing Boing 69 E or whatever, and expect us to research its specs, etc.

laugh

So - With the given that the question is intended to evaluate our ability to realize that the conveyor belt would not prevent the plane from taking off, (Or at least to evaluate our ability to evaluate IF the conveyor belt would prevent take off), rather than our ability to research tire speed ratings and take off specs for every known tire and every known plane combination....

Can you therefore conceed that, assuming the above given, that the plane would therefore take off?

(And I will conceed that I have not researched every known tire/plane combination, and then determined WHICH one was on the belt, etc...)
_________________________
- TJ

2001 Xterra '03 VG33, SE 5 spd, 305/70/16's, Revolvers, UBSkidderz, Doubled AAL's, 3"SL/2"BL, winch/bumpers, skids, sliders, OBA, Snorkel, pine stripes....

Friends don't let friends drive stock.

http://www.gifsoup.com/view/501230/tj-tackling-crawlers-ridge-o.gif

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#617834 - 02/01/07 05:01 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by Paul H:
...Jeff you cannot prove you are 100% right. I agree the plane moves. So shut up about how it moves.....
Stop being a schmuck.

Go take High School Physics.

or:

Disprove F=ma

or:

[Save the fine unicorns]

...

Over and out.

Quote:
Originally posted by TJ:
Interesting...so the only remaining reservations come down to:....
I agree 100%.

Interesting but out of scope.

Quote:
Originally posted by TJ:
[QB.....[Shudder] Urban sprawl [/Shudder]....[/QB]
Not everybody can afford to live in Mercer County! [Finger]

....

Damn, this thread has been a helluva post-whoring opp!!! [LOL]

I'll try to make this my last post!

[Too much XOC]

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#617835 - 02/01/07 05:10 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Anonymous
Unregistered


i choose option B on the train. tuck n roll. instead of jumping out the back and landing on the tracks, i would roll out the train and keep the same speed and slow down. if you run out the back, you will leap and probably fall anyway since you cant be like wile coyote and run off a clif, stop and fall straight down. and how can you know you're running exactly 12mph? what if the train has no windows? how can you judge your speed? if it had windows, you could look outside and find something stationary to keep up with. and you only said the side doors were open, what if the back one was locked? there's alot to consider.

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#617836 - 02/01/07 05:24 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
XPLORx4 Offline
Member

Registered: 23/03/01
Posts: 1906
Loc: San Jose, CA
Quote:
Originally posted by JeffW:
Damn, this thread has been a helluva post-whoring opp!!!
x2. I think I added 50 posts to my count. [Sleep]
_________________________
4x4 in uppercase is $X$!!!
1997 R50: VG33E/RE4R01A/TX10/3.7/R200A/ARB/4.636/H233B/ARB/4.636/321150R15

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#617837 - 02/01/07 08:20 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Anonymous
Unregistered


ok, the plane will fly. finally there were a couple of explanations that made sense. i got too hung up in finding flaws in the 'can fly' group. almost everyone who said it can fly, said it for the wrong reasons. it is a 50/50 guess....and no i couldn't be bothered to read all the pages of dribble either. lol

i am man enough to admit when i am wrong. [Finger]

what's really sad is that in just one week there are more posts in this thread than the phat chick friday thread. [Freak]

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#617838 - 03/01/07 04:14 AM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
TJ Offline
Member
*****

Registered: 08/03/01
Posts: 7756
Loc: Lawrenceville, NJ, USA
I think its because people lingered over each post longer in the Phat Thread...and were more interested in absorbing the information other's posted, than they were in presenting new information.

laugh
_________________________
- TJ

2001 Xterra '03 VG33, SE 5 spd, 305/70/16's, Revolvers, UBSkidderz, Doubled AAL's, 3"SL/2"BL, winch/bumpers, skids, sliders, OBA, Snorkel, pine stripes....

Friends don't let friends drive stock.

http://www.gifsoup.com/view/501230/tj-tackling-crawlers-ridge-o.gif

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#617839 - 03/01/07 05:46 AM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
NY Madman Offline
Member
*

Registered: 09/05/02
Posts: 5232
Loc: Florida
Quote:
Originally posted by Paul H:

I am still of the middle. No one here has absolutely convinced me it will 100% every time take off. To much variables not explained in the scenario. I am not 100% convinced it would stay on the ground either.

I am of the wheels blow up or wheel bearing melts runway run out of room type of guy. I know the plane will move but will the conveyor give enough counter friction to mess up the flight. Depends on me the size of plane and runway which is not laid out.

Small plane long runway I am of the fly theory.

Big plane small runway (small yet large enough for the big plane to take off under normal circumstances) no fly.

That is my opinion.

Jeff you cannot prove you are 100% right. I agree the plane moves. So shut up about how it moves. I am tired of seeing someone else's work in your argument.
Don't worry about what side of the debate you were on. The question itself is intentional designed to immediately confuse people.

Plus some on the board have seen the question before.

Jayz is also correct when he says many of us spent a lot of time trying to prove the theories of others wrong.

This question has confused people with some of the most advanced scientific degrees. What I was amazed about was the amount of pilots who claim that the plane could not take off....and still do.

It probably all comes down to whether you immediately look at things in practical terms or theoretical terms.

You are correct though when you say there will be problems with the wheels. While looking at another site that claimed to have a lot of pilots, there were guys who gave data regarding the amount of stress and abuse the wheels could take. A standard passenger airliner couldn't take the abuse and stress placed on the wheels. They would come apart and the plane would crash... hence no takeoff.

So there was a certain amount of suspension of disbelief involved with the scenario.

The scenario was also good at something else. It kind of proved who here on XOC is capable of civil and reasonable debate and who is not.

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#617840 - 03/01/07 05:50 AM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Anonymous
Unregistered


Quote:
Originally posted by NY Madman:
The scenario was also good at something else. It kind of proved who here on XOC is capable of civil and reasonable debate and who is not.
I would say that all of those involved in the actual debate itself handled themselves quite well. It never really got out of hand to the point of being moved to the ALR. Tempers may have flared, but all-in-all, everyone remained civil.

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#617841 - 03/01/07 06:47 AM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
airbutchie Offline
Member

Registered: 25/01/01
Posts: 2293
Loc: Where the freakin' Rose Parade...
Quote:
Originally posted by Hawk:
Quote:
Originally posted by NY Madman:
[b]The scenario was also good at something else. It kind of proved who here on XOC is capable of civil and reasonable debate and who is not.
I would say that all of those involved in the actual debate itself handled themselves quite well. It never really got out of hand to the point of being moved to the ALR. Tempers may have flared, but all-in-all, everyone remained civil.[/b]
Fuck that shit... I can't believe this thread has overtaken the same amount of input (in less time) as the "Phat" thread!!! frown

Hhehehehehhe... Now go post on the Phat thread and... and.... and... Aw shit, never mind... Hehheheehehe...

- Air B wink
_________________________
SUCK MY BIG CHO-CHO-AAHHHH!!!!!

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#617842 - 03/01/07 12:07 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Anonymous
Unregistered


Yeah, that is kinda pathetic to see how fast this thread grew as opposed to the "phat chicks friday". frown

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#617843 - 03/01/07 01:46 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Paul H Offline
Member

Registered: 23/08/01
Posts: 4757
Loc: Mt. Zion, IL
Quote:
Originally posted by JeffW:
Quote:
Originally posted by Paul H:
[b] ...Jeff you cannot prove you are 100% right. I agree the plane moves. So shut up about how it moves.....
Stop being a schmuck.

Go take High School Physics.

or:

Disprove F=ma

or:

[Save the fine unicorns]

...

Over and out.

Quote:
Originally posted by TJ:
Interesting...so the only remaining reservations come down to:....
I agree 100%.

Interesting but out of scope.

Quote:
Originally posted by TJ:
[QB.....[Shudder] Urban sprawl [/Shudder]....[/b]
Not everybody can afford to live in Mercer County! [Finger]

....

Damn, this thread has been a helluva post-whoring opp!!! [LOL]

I'll try to make this my last post!

[Too much XOC] [/QB]
I am not trying to disprove how the plane moves jackass. Get your head outta your ass and take a reading class or something.
_________________________
2001 Super Black XE R.I.P. 09/05/06
My Blog

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#617844 - 03/01/07 01:47 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Paul H Offline
Member

Registered: 23/08/01
Posts: 4757
Loc: Mt. Zion, IL
Quote:
Originally posted by AHTOXA:
Yeah, that is kinda pathetic to see how fast this thread grew as opposed to the "phat chicks friday". frown
Not really. Was a good debate that remained civil. Good points made by all. You can only look at so many titties [Laughing]
_________________________
2001 Super Black XE R.I.P. 09/05/06
My Blog

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#617845 - 03/01/07 02:00 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
GrayHam Offline
Member

Registered: 17/04/01
Posts: 8849
Quote:
Originally posted by Paul H:
You can only look at so many titties [Laughing]
You know how I know you're gay?

_________________________
Does anybody remember laughter?

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#617846 - 03/01/07 02:05 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Anonymous
Unregistered


Holy shit. 52+ pages. I feel dumber for actually having read the bulk of this.

The plane question is designed to confuse based on anyone's interpretation of the word speed.

If the plane's speed relative to the treadmill was equal, the plan would appear to not be moving and would not take off.

If the plane's speed relative to the air and the stable ground was equal to the treadmill's speed, aside from having to overcome minimal friction at the wheels spinning twice the speed of the plane, it takes off.

Not that all that hasn't been said about 700 times....

Now...in order to maintain airspeed velocity, an African swallow has to beat its wings 37 times a second....Am I right?

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#617847 - 03/01/07 02:16 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Anonymous
Unregistered


BTW, I never understood the hamster references. Hamsters can't fly unless chucked across the room in a fit of rage.

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#617848 - 03/01/07 02:53 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
TJ Offline
Member
*****

Registered: 08/03/01
Posts: 7756
Loc: Lawrenceville, NJ, USA
Quote:
Originally posted by Desert_Rat:
Holy shit. 52+ pages. I feel dumber for actually having read the bulk of this.

The plane question is designed to confuse based on anyone's interpretation of the word speed.

If the plane's speed relative to the treadmill was equal, the plan would appear to not be moving and would not take off.

If the plane's speed relative to the air and the stable ground was equal to the treadmill's speed, aside from having to overcome minimal friction at the wheels spinning twice the speed of the plane, it takes off.

Not that all that hasn't been said about 700 times....

Now...in order to maintain airspeed velocity, an African swallow has to beat its wings 37 times a second....Am I right?
Laden, or unladen?

laugh

The problem is not KNOWING what speed means in the context...as how quickly you are moving your wheels or legs around, unless you are moving proportionally, is not your speed.

Moving AS IF you are going a speed, is not your speed....yet, some people could not get their head's around that.

(I'm stuck in a ditch, spinning my tires...the speedometer SAYS I'm going 40 mph....my tires are turning AS IF I'm going 40 mph....what's my speed?)

The other impediment was the addition of details obviously not part of the posed problem...like tire speed ratings, etc....while missing the fundamental issue.

Its as if the people hear a simple concept based brain teaser, such as ...."If a tree falls in the woods, but there's nobody around to hear it, does it make a noise?"

...And focus on how soft the surrounding trees might be, what time of year it is, how tall the tree might be, the slope of the terrain, wind direction, speed and weather conditions, the type of wood, its density, what made it fall, how old is it, could it have been dropped from a plane into a lake which held a flooded forest, etc...instead of on what noise is, and its relation to observation.

laugh

IE: Instead of using logic to solve the presented question, they focus upon unanswerable and irrelevant potential complications.
_________________________
- TJ

2001 Xterra '03 VG33, SE 5 spd, 305/70/16's, Revolvers, UBSkidderz, Doubled AAL's, 3"SL/2"BL, winch/bumpers, skids, sliders, OBA, Snorkel, pine stripes....

Friends don't let friends drive stock.

http://www.gifsoup.com/view/501230/tj-tackling-crawlers-ridge-o.gif

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#617849 - 03/01/07 03:16 PM Re: Know that if you do not post in this thread today the human race may cease to exist
Chris Mc Offline
Member

Registered: 16/11/00
Posts: 1535
Loc: St Charles, MO
Where are Lizz's nudie pics? I was stranded in a snowstorm outside Albuquerque on I-40 for a few days and missed this thread...

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