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#668603 - 02/06/06 09:08 PM Re: Self-righteous folks.......
Rockaholic Offline
Member

Registered: 18/02/02
Posts: 1632
Loc: Reading, MA
Quote:
Originally posted by JeffW:
Baseball players know what it takes to hit home runs. Strength is a very small part of it. The swing is where it's at.
You ever hear the term "Warning Track Power" before?
Stronger muscles = faster bat speed = more force = longer hit balls.

Quote:
Originally posted by JeffW:
The fact that you said it was unheard of for a player to gain power during their thirties shows you are not a baseball fan. Most of the best hitting seasons in baseball history were by players in their thirties. Babe ruth hit 256 home runs between his 31st and his 36th birthdays...
Wrong, Wrong, Wrong, Wrong, Wrong

Talk about someone talking about something they have no clue about here...
Babe ruth turned 31 on Feb 6th, 1931. He turned 36 in 1936 (also in Feb).
He hits 255 Hr's in between that time peroid - 257 if you count his 2 Hr's in the '32 postseason, which do not get counted towards his 714 Career Homeruns. If you include his playing time as a 36 year old, he hits 298 Hr's (300 including postseason) - but that's just splitting hairs - 256 is close, if not totally accurate...


But the bigger issue here is that you say most of the best hitting seasons in baseball history were by players in their 30's. You site Babe ruth's home run totals in support of that statement.
Well, let's look a little more closely see if that statement still holds up, shall we?

That statement sure sounds and looks good when we look at Barry Bonds numbers, doesn't it. Now keep in mind Barry Bonds was 21 when he debuted in 86 (he turned 22 during the middle of the season), and he turned 30 in 1994

Barry Bond's Stats from 86-94 (21-30 yrs old) -
1281 Games, 4514 AB's, 1287 Hits, .285 BA, 259 HR, .537 Slg, 17.43 Ab per Hr
Barry Bond's stats from 95-04 (31-40 yrs old) -
1435 Games, 4584 AB's, 1443 Hits, .315 BA, 444 HR, .684 Slg, 10.30 Ab per Hr

Wow, you do see an improvement in Barry in his 30's over his 20's - his batting ave raises .030, his sluggin raises .147, and he hits homeruns 7 at bats more rapidly than he did in his 20's.
And to top it all off....
Bonds shows a significant difference in his hitting ability - and it's an increase. Bonds hits 73 homeruns when he is 36 years old - but Bonds only hits 46 Hr's when he's 29 and never over 35 homeruns before he turns 30- and yet after turning 30, he fails to hit under 35 Hr's just twice (one of those years because of injury).

Buit what about historically? Since you Mention Babe Ruth, let's look at his stats - they must obviously show he had better numbers in his 30's than in his 20's and prove that most of the best hitting seasons in baseball history were by players in their 30's.

Babe was 19 when he first Played in 1914 - and he turned 30 in 1925

Babe Ruth's Stats from 14-25 -
1198 Games, 3923 AB's, 1355 Hits, .345 BA, 309 HR, .697 Slg, 12.70 Ab per Hr

But lest we forget, the Red Sox used ruth Solely as a pitcher until 1918 - so he played just once every five days. If we take into consideration Ruth wasn't an "everyday" player until 1918 (23 years old) - but that he still gets days off after starting to rest his arm
Babe Ruth's Stats from 18-25 (23 - 30 Yrs old) -
1032 Games, 3562 AB's, 1247 Hits, .350 BA, 300 HR, .719 Slg, 11.87 AB per Hr
Ruth's stats from 26-35 (31 - 40) -
1305 Games, 4475 AB's, 1518 Hits, .339 BA, 405 HR, .684 Slg, 11.04 Ab per Hr

Wow, statistically - ruth's stats for his 30's (as an everyday player) are not significantly different from his stats in his 20's... a drop in BA of .011; a drop in SLG of .035; and a homerun about one ab less than in his 20's...about one AB because it's exactly a difference of 0.83 AB's between Homeruns...

Yes, Babe did hit 60 Homeruns when he was 32 - but he did hit 54 when he was 25 and 59 when he was 26. 59 is pretty close to 60. And Ruth only fails to hit 35 or more homeruns in his 20's twice - once due to injuries in '25 and in 1919 and 1918 when he was given days off after pitching to rest his arm. And each year after turning 32 Ruth's homerun totals show a decline.

Let's also point out that Ruth hit 6 hr's when he was 40 years old - more than any of his first 4 years (aged 19-23) but then, he also didn't play everyday at those ages because he was a pitcher. From age 24 to age 39 he hits more than 6 HR's every year
Conversely, Bonds hits 45 HR's when he turned 40-more HR's than in all but one year during his 20's.

So, no, JeffW - historically players do not hit signifigantly better in their 30's than in their 20's.
_________________________
Jeffrey
I'm just trying to put my tires on the rocks of life.

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#668604 - 02/06/06 10:34 PM Re: Self-righteous folks.......
NismoXse02 Offline
Member

Registered: 11/03/02
Posts: 4411
Loc: The Woodlands, TX
Quote:
Originally posted by JeffW:
However, if you guys would step off your high horses long enough to catch a game, you would agree that Bonds can hit. That's the bottom line.
You show me someone who didn't think Bonds could hit before the juice (I haven't seen anyone here), I'll show you an idiot. You show me someone who doesn't think Bonds juiced, I'll show you an idiot. You show me someone that doesn't think steroids enhances a players performance, I'll show you an idiot... oh wait. [LOL]
_________________________
Hoosier by birth, Red Raider by choice... like KNIGHT and day.

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#668605 - 03/06/06 10:45 AM Re: Self-righteous folks.......
Origami Gangsta Offline
Member

Registered: 24/05/01
Posts: 6497
Loc: Dammit! Even CLOSER to Smith a...
I'm not sure if you were talking to me Jeff, but I said, mid to upper 30's, not just his 30's. There is a difference.

Statsitically speaking, athletes tend to show signs of wearing down around the age of 32-34 years old. It's more subtle for some than others, but it's a given fact that players wear down before 35. Barry Bonds power numbers increased.

He set the single season record after 35. I'm willing to bet that he's hit more homeruns between 35-40 then anyone else in league history, and probably by quite a significant amount. I don't have time to check into it, but it's a safe bet.

Quote:
Originally posted by Fried Rice Mofo:
He became a power hitter in his mid to late 30's. That is unheard of in the entire echelon of professional sport.
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