Hell, any post that doesent involve calling someone else a moron gets at least a rating of 3 in my book. I'll gladly throw a couple more points your way CamoDatsun.

Ahhh, you will probably take them back at some time...hehehehe...Thanx!

I completely agree with Ian. Most people are lazy. They also don't enjoy driving. Cars and trucks are simply appliances nowadays. People expect to give them gas and point them where to go. With all the fancy suspensions, speed sensitive steering, liquid filled engine mounts, sound deadening material all over, too low tire pressures, navigation systems to tell them where to turn, whisper quiet exhausts, etc, it's no wonder that people feel completely disconnected from the once loved automobile...all the passion is gone...

Well I'll tell you that driving is a passion of mine, that's why I waited FOUR LONG MONTHS for my truck to be built, WITH A MANUAL, and delivered to my spec. I was not going to "settle" for a truck that cost a grand more and took the fun out of the driving experience. I will gladly wait another four months for my next truck if I can still get a manual. Otherwise, parts swapping will ensue!

You said it OnlyOneDR. I also waited 4 months to get the X built for ME, not for a demographic.

I also had to wait. I think it was more like 3 months in my case to get a manual version to my order. The convoy truck arrived, and I picked it up the very next day. I have no regrets whatsoever. I cannot bring myself to like an automatic.

Ian is correct. Cars with manual transmissions are becoming more and more rare here. Porsche and BMW still sell manuals due to the European market, and due to pressure from their respective enthusiast clubs here. Europeans still mostly prefer manual trannys, so most cars and trucks there are manual. :rolleyes:

Ok I have to throw in an opinion here, I have owned manuals all my life and my X is my first Automatic. I do not have numbers or statistics but I will say this, whenever we are on the trail the Automatics have less of a problem climbing, overcoming obstacles and overall control of their vehicle. Now you could chalk it up as experience, so maybe an Automatic is easier to learn how to wheel with?

Either way after our run yesterday I am convinced for the 50th time that Xterras rule.

We now have one of each. I have a 2002 XE V-6 4x4 5-speed and the wife now has a 2003 XE V-6 4x2 Auto. Isn't life great?

Totally agree. Most people that are new to a truck or wheeling should not be doing it in a stick. I've seen more people stall on steep inclines or roll backwards trying to start up an incline because of their lack of skill. Also smoked clutches from starting out on inclines and trying to use the clutch when crawling around in rocky areas.

Anyone can pull the auto in low and creep up a hill, stop, and proceed without major problems. Hardly anyone I know with a manual can do the same safely.

I did a lot of research on this topic before I got my auto SE. I have always been a die hard manual tranny wheeler and the X is the first auto I've ever owned. After going through countless virtual pages of virtual BS, the only downside I could find with automatics is a slight lack of control when going downhill due to the shift points being set by the tranny and not the driver. So, you learn to compensate - no big deal.

I am an "American" driver and do not consider myself lazy or incompetent, nor do I have anything to prove by shifting my way through rush hour traffic. And I DO take my truck offroad. My X does just fine both on and off-road and I do not regret my choice (except for my friend Nick who constantly rags on me about going over to the Dark Side and joining the "herd" of automatic drivers after listening to me say over and over "I"ll never own a 4WD automatic...")

I suppose this thread could go on forever, but it's a lot less of a pain in the ass for it to go on with an automatic

I dunno - I commute in suburban DC traffic with the X (and when not driving the X, drive a Miata 5 speed), and have commuted in SoCal traffic in the past with a manual transmissions and never found it that big of a deal.

It just boils down to personal preference. I just enjoy the hell out of the 5 speed. I was going to get an automatic in the X, but then I test drove then went and rented a 5 speed for a week and that changed my mind. I'm still enjoying every minute of it. When driving becomes a chore, then I suppose I will succumb and migrate to an automatic.

Thank god that time hasn't come for me yet, and I still enjoy actually driving rather than just sitting and steering...

To each his own - I have no problem with automatics - just as long as they are in other peoples vehicles

From what I can tell when driving off-road, the stick has not been that much of a problem. I guess it's all what your used to or willing to put up with. I always thought their would be less of a chance being stranded with a stick. I agree going up hill and over obstacles with an auto would be easier. I just put her in low and go. When I test drove the S/C X auto v.s. S/C X stick that made my choice clear. As far as resale goes maybe the amount of perspective buyers will be less trying to sell a 5-speed, but hey maybe someone will be willing to pay the asking prices just to have the 5-speed.

I'd hate to start a different, er..., discussion but this has been touched on only once.

Now correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the tow capacity based on the highest gear? It would make sense that an auto would be rated to pull more based on tranny because it's a 4. Your rpm's are going to drop on a manual once you shift it into 5th. 1500 lbs sounds like a lot.

Do I have it?

I have a 5 speed and love it. If I ever lose an arm or leg, I'll switch to auto...it's just no fun!

If you ever get a chance drive Red Cone Pass in Western Colorado. Going up is tricky but going down in an Auto is Suicide. I did the trail with a friend in an 01 TJ with an Auto and I have never felt closer to Death in my life. The next week it did it again in my 94 Cherokee with a 5 spd. Well ill never own a 4x4 with an Auto, case closed for me. Much better control over the vehicle in all cases which is what you need while wheeling. Auto's are for lazy people who think they can wheel (Granted some need them for physical limitations). 5 spd all the way for me.

The TJ would feel a bit more out of control with the shorter wheelbase.

I've driven Red Cone several times in my 5 speed Xterra, and it's full brakes all the way down. It doesn't make much difference between manual and auto with stock gearing, but I'm looking forward to trying the 3.92:1 gears this Summer.

I disagree strongly, you call me lazy because I drink my coffee, and smoke a cigarette, and I do not want to shift and spill my coffee?
In addition it is much easier to get intimate with my girlfriend in an Auto, I have tried it with the manual and really the shifter gets most of the fun not you. I also love smelling other peoples clutches on the trail. Some of the best wheelers I know drive Automatics.

Your not driving then - you are drinking and smoking. Driving is actually paying attention to what you are doing and you can't do that if you are focused on a beverage or a cigarette - and forget both at the same time (you do at least keep one hand on the wheel or are your knees and integral part of steering?)

It never ceases to amaze me how few people actually take driving seriously. Just looking around here in the DC metro area it's obvious that it isn't that high of a priority with all the dented up cars with bashed in rear-ends. It makes me want to get a hitch and the biggest receiver ball I can find....

I agree, it was my dry humor that got the best of me. If I smoke my coffee is in the cupholder.

If your gonna be doing some real offroading (not just improved dirt roads) then a 5 spd is the way to go. Sure its tougher to get up an incline but going up is always easier than going down. Truck, bike, or quad, I always look at an incline from the perspective of "am I going to be able to get back down this?" I've gone down trails that I'm positive I would've never made it down in an auto. But get an auto if you're a soccer mom. Get an SUV that's more suited to luxury while you're at it. 4wd on an auto tranny isn't for offroading, its for getting up a slippery boat launch ramp.

Done both.

Lived life in Colorado rockies, pulled boat to slippery ramps, driven down red cone pass, and several other hair-raising adventures. Done all of it with stick (early years) and auto; and I will say, wheel-base has a LOT to do with confidence.

Granted wheel base's were not the same, nor gearing. Early 4-wheelin was done in '76 1/2 Chevy standard long-bed; as time has passed, that ole truck has long been retired. But it had been to he and back

Had 78 chevy 3/4, long-bed, 4-by, 350 standard - fantastic as well. Carried weight fantastically, but tricky on the boat dock with a 12' camper. Better without, but she was a heavy truck anyway. For obvious reasons, too big for trail use, but had more than her fair share of finding that perfect sandy/tree hidden area on the lake.

Now have much newer 3/4 chevy, ext. cab, 4-by, standard, 454. Standard was not first choice, but no one else in town had this truck in an auto. Won't ever be on those old trails, way too big for that.

In regards to boat docking with this truck versus the auto, or even parking the boat. Love the chevy, but would take an auto anyday. Regular mountain driving (I-70) is great, but I believe it's more the power in that big V-8 versus my daily driver/trail hugger Suv's V6's.

Both current SUV's are auto's - had these in many of the same areas as the first chevy. Slightly shorter wheelbase's (107"), much different gearing; but very good stability, and less trickiness.

Old good friend has Jeep wrangler, standard - go anywhere, do anything. But, I refuse to ride in it, feels extremely top-heavy, leans too much and just feels overall like the rear is going to topple end over end coming down steep slopes.