Quote:
Originally posted by BlueSky:
Go back in your corner. He can handle his own conversation.
OK - I asked you a question, and you've chosen to ignore it... I wasn;'t jumping into "your" conversation, as much as I've been waiting for an answer from you to mine.
So let me show you the problem with your argument...and pay atention this time. I understand you claim to be a "a fairly intelligent person with a long background in aviation." So why don't you prove that and read thorugh this and show me where I'm wrong.

Quote:
Originally posted by BlueSky:
It's a given that the tires are mounted on freewheeling, unpowered wheels. Still, something has to happen for any wheeled craft or vehicle to move.

For our purposes, let's define "roll" as rotation over stationary ground, resulting in movement. "Movement" means covering a given distance. Agree? Good.
Ok, so based on that statrement a plane moving at 100mph with it's wheels on solid ground must have the wheels rolling over the ground at 100mph.

Quote:
For an aircraft at rest on the ground with the landing gear down, how does [b]any kind of propelling force - a tow tractor, people pushing, engine power, or a downhill slope as examples - become forward motion? How does the plane itself accelerate forward? Move from point A to point B? How does ANY FORCE applied to the plane result in forward movement?

One thing must happen for the plane to move. The tires must roll. It doesn't matter how that propelling force is applied but for that aircraft to move forward, the tires, mounted on their freewheeling, unpowered wheels, must roll. That's why we need brakes and wheel chocks, right?
[/b]
OK, I'm going to give you that one....

Quote:

What happens when the tires, mounted on their freewheeling, unpowered wheels, roll? The plane moves along the ground. This is, IMHO, one missing link for the WFers - the rolling tires only travel forward because [b]the ground is stationary. That distance, as we know, is a certain amount per tire rotation depending on their size.

But when the belt is added, the ground under the plane is in effect moving in the opposite direction. Forward movement is no longer the result of applying any kind of propelling force because...why?

The tires are no longer rolling along the stationary ground, they're rotating in place. And since the freewheeling, unpowered wheels they're mounted upon are on an axle attached to the plane, if the tires are not moving forward, neither is the plane.[/b]
Ok, now you have a problem with your argument- it's flawed - badly.
Here's why:

If the plane has the front wheels on the conveyor belt and the rear wheels on solid ground - you now have a contradiction.

According to you the plane will not move because the front wheels are on the conveyor and "the ground under the plane is in effect moving in the opposite direction. Forward movement is no longer the result of applying any kind of propelling force because the tires are no longer rolling along the stationary ground, they're rotating in place. And since the freewheeling, unpowered wheels they're mounted upon are on an axle attached to the plane, if the tires are not moving forward, neither is the plane."

But the rear wheels are on solid ground and since the plane is moving at 100mph, "One thing must happen for the plane to move. The tires must roll. It doesn't matter how that propelling force is applied but for that aircraft to move forward, the tires, mounted on their freewheeling, unpowered wheels, must roll."

Now the problem is that the front and rear wheels are mounted to the exact same plane. Now based on what you claim, the planes wheels on the conveyor do not move in relation to the ground (no rolling) because that counteracts the planes speed of 100mph, yet the rear wheels must roll because the plane is moving at 100mph (otherwise the conveyor isn't moving at all), and since they roll that means they move in relation to the ground...

So now I ask you again:
[b]How do the front wheels remain stationary while the rear wheels are moving when the distance between the wheels remains a constant?[/b}
_________________________
Jeffrey
I'm just trying to put my tires on the rocks of life.