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#142270 - 08/05/08 02:34 PM
Anyone with sharp google skills out there?
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Member
Registered: 17/10/00
Posts: 6013
Loc: Prior Lake, MN
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A bunch of us were bored at lunch today and we started wondering, "Where does the water go when you wash your hands for flush a toilet on the 70th floor of a skyscraper?"
A google of the topic uncovered some cool technology that collects and actually treats and recycles water every few floors of a modern high-rise.
What about old school? From the top of the empire state building, I can see water getting pumped UP to supply different floors but simple math would tell you that a gallon of flushed water falling straight down 800 feet would blow out any pipe. Does the pipe spiral down? how many pipes are there? Do they put septic tanks in every 5 floors and treat/empty them every so often?
It's bugging me.
Another show-stopper seems to be, "why does the hotel maid always stop up the bathtub drain after she cleans it?" I can't find the answer to that one either.
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kjw & the PNUTMNM
The liver is evil, and must be punished...
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#142271 - 08/05/08 02:44 PM
Re: Anyone with sharp google skills out there?
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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First question my guess is that there is a main drain pipe of sufficent diameter that it'll handle every toilet in the facility flushing at the same time. Second question is that they are avoiding sewer gas that may come out of the drain if the unit is not used and it dries out. I'm a facilities Tech, but I only have one floor and don't have any direct experience with high rise buildings. I get a lot of smelly floor drains when the trap primers aren't working properly, which seems always the case with hard water out here. Good luck with your google quest. ![[Wave]](graemlins/wave.gif)
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#142272 - 08/05/08 02:53 PM
Re: Anyone with sharp google skills out there?
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Member
Registered: 17/10/00
Posts: 6013
Loc: Prior Lake, MN
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Originally posted by Conundrum: First question my guess is that there is a main drain pipe of sufficent diameter that it'll handle every toilet in the facility flushing at the same time.
Second question is that they are avoiding sewer gas that may come out of the drain if the unit is not used and it dries out.
I'm a facilities Tech, but I only have one floor and don't have any direct experience with high rise buildings.
I get a lot of smelly floor drains when the trap primers aren't working properly, which seems always the case with hard water out here.
Good luck with your google quest. Excellent answer for the bathtub question! Your proposed solution for the skyscraper still has me wondering. Even if the pipe is hella-big around, you have to allow for say, 15 flushes at once. That's about 20 gallons of water and poop that would weigh at least 160lbs. Send 160lbs straight down say, 800 feet... that's a BUNCH of energy heading for whatever is at the bottom. Shit, BOOM, bah...
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kjw & the PNUTMNM
The liver is evil, and must be punished...
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#142273 - 08/05/08 03:57 PM
Re: Anyone with sharp google skills out there?
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Here's what I found: LINK Drainage
Drainage is another common issue in skyscrapers, and is often just as difficult to solve as water pressure problems. When water falls vertically down a pipe, the water will adhere to the pipe's walls until the pipe's cross sectional area is about one-fourth full. Once the gravity propelled water hits a horizontal bend in the pipe, the flow velocity drops dramatically, and fills the pipe considerably more due to the lost speed. It is common practice to use relief or yoke vents to slow the water before it encounters a horizontal flow change. The piping at the base of a vertical drainage column must be secured, as to reduce the risk of breaking joints.
Venting For water to travel down a vertical pipe, air is necessary. Air ventilation must be controlled so that low pressure zones can be created, and the flow of water can continue. The low pressure zones should not be placed near a fixture, or else poor drainage could occur (often recognized by a gulping sound and poor flow performance). It is however okay to place air vents in the fixtures themselves to increase water flow. Material
Most high-rise plumbing systems use Type-L copper. On some very tall buildings, stainless steel must be used because of the extra pressure. OR I found this interesting: Hydroelectric Sewer Power Generation Hydroelectric Sewer Power Generation: Now that's the S*%T! ![[LOL]](graemlins/lol.gif)
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#142274 - 08/05/08 06:41 PM
Re: Anyone with sharp google skills out there?
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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If you watch the episode of Dirty Jobs where Mike goes to replace a water tower on a NYC building...the city water pressure can only get water 6 stories up, so anything over 6 stories has a water tower and the water is pumped up with an auxiliary pump into the tower. The water is then fed by gravity to the rest of the floors.
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#142275 - 09/05/08 07:22 AM
Re: Anyone with sharp google skills out there?
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Member
Registered: 17/10/00
Posts: 6013
Loc: Prior Lake, MN
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Thanks Conundrum, I looked everywhere... I had a feeling it wasn't a routine problem to solve. I read an article once in architectural digest about the big problems of skyscrapers and their solutions, like they "swaying in the wind" problem, or the smokestack effect that elevator shafts cause when they provide a free "channel" for air to move through when it tries to equalize pressure or temperature. It said that without revolving doors, you would have to walk through a hurricane force wall of wind when you exited an elevator on the 100th floor! not good if you're wearing a kilt... 
_________________________
kjw & the PNUTMNM
The liver is evil, and must be punished...
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#142277 - 09/05/08 12:33 PM
Re: Anyone with sharp google skills out there?
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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to accommodate fire fighters and EMS. That my friend is a fire code.  sorta what I do..
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#142278 - 09/05/08 01:06 PM
Re: Anyone with sharp google skills out there?
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Member
Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 1004
Loc: High Point, NC
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Originally posted by BlueSky: Anyone know why code now requires standard doors alongside revolving ones?
I strongly believe that some people are just too stupid to use revolving doors!
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#142279 - 09/05/08 07:33 PM
Re: Anyone with sharp google skills out there?
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Member
Registered: 17/08/00
Posts: 2286
Loc: Georgia
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Originally posted by far west X: to accommodate fire fighters and EMS. That my friend is a fire code. sorta what I do..You're right, sort of, but a specific event caused the code to be written. And it wasn't for for fire/EMS personnel to get in...it was for customers to get out. The 1942 Cocoanut Grove nightclub fire in Boston killed 492 people. The only front entrance was a revolving door, which quickly filled with panicked customers and jammed, blocking their escape. Firefighters actually had to dismantle it to gain access. Other exit doors were locked, or get this - WELDED shut to keep people from skipping on their bills. Other doors opened inward, making them nearly impossible to open against the crowd of people frantically trying to escape. Found out while observing flight attendant training in my old job that they're trained to designate a person to keep people back while opening emergency exits, which open inward on many jets. Some open up or sideways into the fuselage, like a pocket door. Airliner doors are generally plug-type doors. After the cabin pressurizes, plug-type doors literally can't open. Those dramatic stories about someone trying to open a door at altitude? BS. King Kong couldn't open a plug door against the pressure differential at altitude. The only ones I know of that open outward are the overwing exits on the latest 737-series jets. Poor-quality shot but you get the idea: 
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#142280 - 10/05/08 11:27 AM
Re: Anyone with sharp google skills out there?
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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good stuff. But unfortunately thats how all fire codes are made. After someone dies in a fire.
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