Ok here's it is can i run my front components and a sub off of a 4 channel amp and use deck power for the rear 6x9s? I don't see the point in having either 2 amps, or a 5 channel because the rear provides very minimal "fill" IMO. You audio gurus let me know if this will work. Thx

That should work fine so long as the amp you have is bridgeable to 3 channels. And you are correct, in competition audio installs, rear speakers are used only for fill to make the sound fuller. the ideal image should be coming from the middle of your hood (tough to do without a customer speaker install). Good luck.

Which amp are you thinking of getting?

I ran my S10 system in that exact fashion. I used a PPI PCX440 (4x40). Channels 1 & 2 drove the Memphis 6.5 coaxials in the doors and channels 3 & 4 bridged to my JL 8w3 behind the seat (standard cab). It sounded AWESOME.

If you've got the money, check out the JL 450/4
http://www.jlaudio.com/amps/4504.html

well been thinking about pickin up a kicker kx350.4 http://www.cardomain.com/item/KIC04KX35042 and for a sub i might go with a Punch stage 2 http://www.cardomain.com/item/ROCP210S8 nothing to crazy. I used to have an integra with mb quart components and 2 jl10w6 and it just rattled my car apart eventually. I'm more into sound quality and have less disposable income now so this seems like a good combo....BTW i already have a set of pioneer ts 6160r components waiting for an amp to install. Again i'm all about sound quality on a budget :p

Do NOT use the deck to power the rear speakers.
Some of the most important things in sound quality for car audio is clean, consistent power and predictable output from your components.

However, you can still use the 4-channel amp to do the entire system. Take the front 2 channels of the amp and push all 4 front & rear speakers, equalling a 2-ohm stereo load. This is ok since music is recorded in stereo (left and right), not front and rear. You will lose Fading capabilites, but who uses that anyways?

Then take the rear channels of the amp and sum them for a increased mono ouput for the sub. You now have a fully amplified system that will sound much better than if you ever use the 12-15 watts of useless power from the CD player.

ron you don't feel that the rear speakers are simply for fill? Soundstage is meant to come from the front imo. Would powering rear speakers w/stock deck=terrible sound??

Nutz, it all comes down to how you are using the system. It sounds to me that you are NOT trying to win any SPL competitions or trying to impress anyone with a system that can be heard from 4 blocks away. In my 14 years of installing car audio and video systems, I have learned that everyone has their own agendas. Running your rear 6x9's off of the factory deck will not equal poor sound unless you turn your headunit volume up past 3/4 which is around where you will experience clipping. But since you are using an amp to power the fronts and the sub, you shouldn't need to turn the headunit up that loud to get the volume that suits your listening needs. There is no need put the extra burden on the amp of running the 6x9's if you feel that the rears are only for fill (which i completely agree with). This is of course just MY opinion and there are people that will disagree with me. Good luck and have fun with whatever you may decide to do.

I COMPLETELY agree with rear speakers being for rear-fill. I completely DISAGREE with running some speakers off of a head unit and some off of an amplifier - all of which are playing the same frequencies.

My agenda is the ultimate in sound quality. Unlike others on this board, I have a resume to back up actually understanding SQ and what it takes to achieve it.

If you want the honest truth, in most vehicles that desire depth in their sound system, and a very realistic and wide sound stage, I usually don't do ANY rear speakers. The last thing you want to do is have rear speakers that are going to sound different than the fronts, especially if you are going for rear-fill.

Amplifying rear speakers has nothing to do with SPL, as only the subs really dictate your bass output. Onyx's 14 years of doing this should have helped him understand what I was trying to say.....but then again I see people everyday in this industry that have done it 20+ years, and have done it wrong for 20+ years.

If you want to know business, do you listen to your high school economics teacher who has been teaching 20 years, or Donald Trump? Reputations speak for themselves.

Ron, I don't doubt your resume or your knowledge. I'm sure you and I could both sit down and put together a kick a$$ system for Nutz in his Xterra. Of course if money were not an issue. In this case, money is an issue as stated in an above comment from Nutz. If Nutz were TRULY worried about sound quality, he should replace the factory headunit, wiring, speakers, amps, add some sound damping, make custom fiberglass enclosures for ALL of his speakers and reposition them for the most accurate soundstage. All Nutz is trying to do here is live in a realistic world where he can improve on what he has for a reasonable amount of money. He doesn't mention that he is replacing the rear speakers. So hooking the factory 6x9's up in parallel with the fronts isn't going to improve the sound versus if he left the rears hooked up to the factory headunit. The tone of the speakers will be different regardless of the power source. Why make that Kicker amp work harder and hotter than it really needs to?

Now, If Nutz wanted to drop about $5000 on a new system, my advice would be completely different.

I was not implying that amplifying rear speakers have anything to do with SPL. My point was merely that it doesn't seem like he's the type who wants a system for more than his own enjoyment and is not looking at spending a lot of money to impress others.

hey guys...here's my ?s regarding running fronts and rears in parallel off 2 of the 4 channels:

1) crossover - you'd only have one xover point for all four speakers. I know for fact that aftermarket 6" rounds in the doors will carry way more midbass then 6x9s can ever hope to. If you had 4 identical speakers, then this isn't as much of an issue...NOT the case here

2) gain - again, you'd have one gain setting for all four speakers. Rear "fill" is just that....fill. You don't want the same power going to the rears as you do the fronts....ESPECIALLY if you have aftermarket fronts and stock rears.

personally, I'd just disconnect the rears and go with a three speaker setup, but if Nutz wants to keep his rear fill from the 6x9s, I'm going with OnyxXterra on this one and say he should just leave them on "stock" power

PS: Nutz, when you put in the new front drivers, do NOT forget to disconnect that crappy pillar tweeter.

Skydive814, you are correct. running the fronts and rears in parallel will lose the ability to adjust the sound from the front to the rear and vice versa.

The crossover point is another issue here. Since there is a sub involved, the crossover point should be in the AREA of maybe 50Hz. The factory speakers will NOT be able to handle that frequency level with 60 watts pushing it.

The 3 speaker setup is an option for Nutz, then down the road, if he picks up a pair of Pioneer 6x9's he can add them in and THEN I would agree with Ron that he should run them in parallel with the front components or else get a new amp to power the sub and use the 4 channel Kicker to power the fronts/rears.

I would hope that Nutz will be disconnecting the factory tweeters to install the new ones. He did say that the fronts were going to be components.

Thx for the help guys. Seems like i caused quite a stir between a couple of you guys :p But that seems to be a common occurence on this board lol. Onyx you are right about me having new components up front, i just have yet to install them as i dont' have an amp and sub yet and i want to run all the wiring at once. In my past systems i've had 2 amps but feel that i'm over the "bumping" stage of my life. Only bumping i feel like doing now is either in the bed, or over rocks What do you guys think of the amp i posted being "RENEWED." All the components i've bought in the past have either been brand new or slightly used by friends that i know and trust. It says that it comes w/a 3 month manufacturer warranty which says something i guess. But i cannot get over the fact that this renewed price is half the price of a brand new one (a big plus) Let me know and thanks for all the great input!!!

As for the amp: It's a brand name that can be trusted. It does come with a 3 month warranty from the manufacturer. I say go for it.

Have fun with the system no matter what you do with it.

Nutz,

You do realize that kicker amp will give you Bridged RMS Power @ 4 Ohms: 175W x 2 @ 14.4V

Your sub RMS rating is 200W, and it's a single coil 8 Ohm sub, meaning you'll only get 1/2 of the 175W (give or take). You should either get two 8 ohm subs and run them parallel, OR (my advice) one better quality dual 2 or 8 ohm voice coil sub.

dual 8 ohm in parallel gives you 4 ohm and
dual 2 ohm in series gives you 4 ohm

basically, make sure the load of your sub is at MOST 4 ohm if you really are set on that amp.

let me know if you need other suggestions.

Jason

I did in my X just what you are explaining. I have Focal components in the front running off of the front channels of the 4 channel amp. The rear channels of the amp I bridged for the JL8w3 I put in the factory sub location (I had to modify the box a little to make it fit). The other 6x9 is powered from the factory amp. It sounds fine. I don't even hear the rear 6x9, that's for the people in the back seat anyway. I chose not to parallel the front channels of the amp because in my experience you loose sound quality not to mention the ability to fade (I would much rather hear the Focals in the front more than the 6x9). Just my $.02

Shiet, didn't realize it was had a impedence rating of 8 ohms......Guess i'll have to look for different sub options now! Ok edit that i think this would probably do fine for me: http://www.cardomain.com/item/POLDB104DVC but can you run 2 channels of an amp at 4 ohms and the other 2 channels at 2 ohm?

yes you can. but more than likely you are not going to bridge the amp for the sub. I did and I thought it was too loud. It makes more rattles than good sounds.

get some dynamat, the X's are rattle boxes...take my word for it......

http://icd.ics.purdue.edu/~berk/pictures/MyXterra/

hey Cd i finally got my amp installed and running it to the sub ... as for the new speakers i installed in the front doors i notice the sound it alot crisp compared to the factory 2ohms ... as for the sub i wired each channel form the amp to each voice coil ... running in stereo i belive ... after a few weeks i have notice the speaker is ratling ... wondering if the 10 sub speaker is not getting enough power to it or should i wire from the amp to a single voice coil on the speaker?

Just thought i'd update on an old post. I just finished installing my system sunday. I already had a pioneer deh8600 HU and decided to go with a kicker 350.4, pioneer ts-c160R components and a jl 10w0 sub. I left the rear stock as they are barely audible as is. System sounds great and i hardly sacrificed any space. (.65 cu. ft. box.) Nothing to fancy, but i'm very happy w/my sound system now. The w0 is low end for JL, but it still sounds solid. Oh i also "dynamatted" the front doors and am thinking about doing the same to the rear cargo area. I put "" around dynamat cuz it's not Dynamat brand, but rather the exact same thing from Mcmasters car supply. It was still half the price of Dynamat even though they raped me on shipping.

This is a great thread for those of us who are thinking about upgrading their sound system and know absolutely nothing about it. Thanks for the info everyone.

Sounds like a good setup. A lot of guys will try and sell you on mega million watt amps and crap, but not everyone has the same priorities. When I setup my X I was trying to get good sound quality, good balance, and save space. In order to do that I ran small amplifiers that fit under my seats. I have 30W going to each speaker and 110W going to a 10" sub. The sub is the only thing that takes up any space, and it's minimal AND removeable. You know what? That 30W per channel is plenty and the system sounds great. So what if I can't shatter windows or blow my eardrums out in 5 minutes! My system sounds far better than most of the mega million watt systems I've heard. I also used Dynamat and some 1/2" thick sound padding of some sort in the back. Makes quite a difference in making the bass tighter, and also reduced the amount of bass being heard outside the truck; meaning less attention drawn to me.

Anyway, the main thing is that you are happy with the sound and you've met your goals.