As background, I am in the service and have imported the first 2005 Xterra (Off Road 4x4) in Europe. The Patrol, Xtrail, and Turbo Diesel Pathfinder are the only Nissan SUVs sold through the dealerships over here.

This morning I go into the local Nissan dealership in my small village to schedule my 7,500 mile service visit. I try to explain to the service manager/salesman/owner/janitor (all the same guy) that I want an oil change and a tire rotation. Easy enough, right? Wrong!

First of all, he doesn’t understand the concept of tire rotation. I show him uneven wear on the front tires and explain that the tires need moved to the rear and the rear tires need to be moved to the front to ensure even wear. He misses my point altogether. He thinks my alignment is out.

Secondly, he asks how old the truck is and I say less than 6 months old. He askes why I wanted my oil changed because the European Nissans go 50,000 kilometers (31,000 miles) between oil changes! He thinks I'm being wasteful and environmentally irresponsible.

I finally show him my service book and he just scratches his head. He claims the Germans NEVER rotate tires and hardly ever change the oil. He was amazed the Nissan service book called for oil changes every 3 months (3,700 miles) and maintenance checks every 6 months. He said the German Warranty doesn’t require any maintenance checks until after the first 12 months!

Heres my question: have we all been brainwashed into thinking US maintenance intervals are what’s best for our vehicles? How can the same manufacture have such varying requirements from continent to continent? Is it just another case of manufacturers bowing to the whims of an over-litigious and wasteful society?

Cases in point:

Car owner: “I can’t check my tire pressure on a regular basis” ...a few blow-out induced accidents later (and lawsuits), the manufacture dictates increased warranty directed tire inspections.

Car owner: “I can’t check my oil level every time I fill up” ...a few blown engines due to oil starvation later (and failed warranty claims), manufactures and oil companies dictate increased oil change frequency.

Save the consumer from themselves!

IMHO, no matter how hard you drive your car or how harsh the environment, you will never put the wear and tear on your vehicle that the average driver does here in Europe ...trust me.

I'm off my soap box now ...Bo out!

i can testify that a Toyota 22RE egine(the little 4 banger they used to put in everything) with 40,000 miles on it and an oil change will go another 23,000 miles without an oil change...

at which point various engine components grenade.

hey, i was 19 and stupid.

I do think 3,000 miles is insane... and horribly waste full and expensive(over the life of the vehicle) 5 - 7 k seems reasonable.

I guess the question is, do they use synthetic oil over there? If so 3000 miles per change is a bit much. If not, take a look at oil after 5000+ miles in a car, it's not pretty looking.

Same Toyota, not sure if I ever changed oil in it. 30 000 miles doesn't too far off to what I put the Toyota through. Hey, I was 17, stupid and didn't have any money. It still lasted to 300 000 miles and the engine was still great, the body looked like swiss cheese, thats all.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if the maintenance recomendation we have resulted from lawyer types. I'm not saying that regular maintenance is wrong, but I'm sure the truck can endure more abuse.

Synthetic isn't that popular over here.

My Grandfather used to determine his oil change interval by putting a drop of oil off the dipstick onto a piece of paper towel. If the oil spread out and left a dark spot in the middle he'd drive another month and check it again. He told me that's how truckers used to check their oil. I believe he would change his filter regularly but only top off the oil until it became too dirty to spread on the towel.

1) The "3,000 mile oil change" interval is dictated by the quick oil change companies (like Jiffy Lube), not by manufacturers. Most manufacturers in the US have a 7,500 mile interval recommendation, and have for years.

2) Europeans don't change their oil nearly as oftne, because oil is extremely expensive over there. Manufacturers don't recommend changing it as often, because they know the people aren't going to do so, anyways; it costs too much. And they don't want to give the impression that their engines require more maintenance than anybody elses.

3) Yes, the US manufacturers severely underestimate the amount of time needed between oil changes, for several reasons. One of which is that oil is cheap, here. Another is that we have a sue-happy culture. No harm is done by changing the oil earlier, so there's no benefit to the manuf. to recommend longer change intervals. Convincing americans that we shouldn't "waste" $30 every few months is a losing battle. Most americans have it beat into them that the $30 is a small price to pay, and you never know what could happen, so change it every 3,000 miles to be safe...

You can learn a lot about this stuff at car-talk.com, and bobistheoilguy.com, if you've got a lot of freetime to read up.

Interesting topic. I wouldn't be surprised, in light of higher oil prices, if those numbers don't go up.

30 years ago engine oil probably was a lot more important with less than perfect manufacturing processes in place which led to a lot of friction and engine wear, not to mention lower over all effeciency. Modern engines, using modern manufacturing techniques, seem to put an emphasis on the reduction of friction in an effort to boost performance and effeciency (HP/MPG).

Just a guess though - I haven't seen my X's oil after 3700 miles yet though..

I wonder how many miles they get out of an engine before it gives up..

If you really want to know if it is time to change your oil, send it to a lab for analysis. It doesn't cost very much, and by testing over time, they can help you determine what the perfect oil change interval is for your driving style/conditions.

Here is a website for a lab that does good work:
Blackstone Labs

I think many of the service intervals are set up for maximum dealer profit, and safety margin. But what that guy is saying :rolleyes: As long as you dont use Penzoil, I see no reason you cannot go 6-7K on oil changes. I usually find other reccomended fluid changes too often as well. Experience with my vehicles off-road has given me a good feel for when those fluids need changed.

im changing the oil on the X every 5000 miles, my buddy was looking into getting a Mini Cooper S, when we took it for a rip we were talking to the sales guy about maintainance, he said that the first oil change on a brand new engine was recommended to be done at 10,000 miles, then 15,000 miles every time after that, so in the period of 100k miles, you would only change the oil around 6 times, or once a year? i dont know if i trust that, especially on a brand new engine with the same oil for 10,000 miles?

I know when i changed my oil for the first time in the X at 1500 miles it was as black as tar. I don't know if there is an addititive in there from the factory or something, but it was the blackest oil I had ever seen. The second oil change I did at 3000 just to see if it looked the same and all was good. I am up to 6000 miles now and will stick with the owners manual time table to make sure I have no problems with the warranty.

I haven't had the chance to change the oil in the X yet, but I change the oil in my Impala every 9K. Comes out pretty clean, too; mainly highway miles. I disagree with changing it every 3K, that is a total waste unless your vehicle just eats the stuff up.

I plan to use M1 for the first time at my 7,500 mile oil change. I noticed the owners manual states:

NISSAN recommends mineral based oils. These
oils must, however, meet the API quality and SAE
viscosity ratings specified for your vehicle.

Will synthetics void the warranty or cause issue if there is an oil based engine malfunction/failure?

Is it important to get all the dino oil out before adding the synth?

Thanks!

Here's a link to the Mobil 1 myths page: Link.

You can read it in detail, but the bottom line is you can use Mobil 1 synthetic at any point, you don't need to flush your engine, and it can't void your warranty since it meets the same API ratings as the regular dyno oil (Mazda being the 1 exception with their rotary engine).

FWIW, my Nissan dealership does a free oil change at 1000 miles. They use a Castrol 5W-30 synthetic blend.

SMS, I quoted your question here

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2245172

maybe you'll get some more opinions on your question...

I had a 1.6Ltr Ford 4 banger in England and the Service manual advised 15k miles between changes. The Vauxhall (GM) cavalier 1.6 4 banger I had before that had 200k miles on it, 100k of which I did myself. I maybe changed the oil every 20k miles. My dads 2.6Ltr 24valve V6 Ford has a 10k mile reccomended service interval.

I thought it was very unusual to have only a 3.5k mile reccomended oil change as well when I got my first car here in the US. I always figured it was a consipracy so the US oil companies make more money.

I changed my oil at 3720 miles. I put in Mobil 1 Truck & SUV 5W-40. After about 4100 miles, I changed the filter and took a sample and sent it to Blackstone Labs. They reported my engine looked normal for a new engine. The oil had lots of additive left. I will be going to at least 8000 miles between changes with Mobil 1.

I got my 7,500 mile service done this week with a few updates for you guys.

My bill came to 102 Euro ($125 USD) and I supplied the oil (Mobil 1), filter, and crush washer. I thought that was a little steep until I saw the price if I hadn’t supplied the oil.

The oil here runs between 20 and 25 Euro ($24-$31 USD) per liter for regular oil, not synthetic. That's minimum $144 just for the 5.1 liters (5 3/8 Qts) of the generic oil or $186 for Castrol GTX. At those prices I’d only get my oil changed once a year too.

I was mistaken when I mentioned earlier that the Germans go 50,000 kilometers between oil changes. The sales manager/service manager/owner/janitor (all the same guy again) and I were talking about the long service intervals and he said "between 50,000 and 16,000 kilometers are normal service intervals here".

This statement did not make sense to me at all. Knowing his English is not so good I asked him if he meant fünfzisch (50) thousand or fünfzehn (15) thousand kilometers. He apologized and said he often confuses 50 with 15 in English. What he had meant all along was 15,000 kilometers or a little over 9,000 miles.

In summary:

Dealership servicing here is expensive…
Oil over here is damned expensive…
And no one drives 50,000 kms between oil changes.

Bo out!

Well, right or wrong, I would never go over 5k on an oil change and definitely not longer than that for the filter!

If I was to go up to 7.5k on the oil, I would definitely change the filter once in between!