I was watching mission to mars on the Discovery Channel last night when one of the astronauts quoted your President Kennedy.

“We choose to go to the moon. We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win, and the others, too. “

That portion of his speech got me thinking. Not about going to the moon or going to Mars, but thinking about the current political situation in the U.S. and how you guys are in a bit of an economic and sociological pickle (I’m not going to list them…I’m sure you can figure them out). I googled and re-read the speech a couple of times over and am still flabbergasted by this man’s (President John F. Kennedy) vision, insight, articulation and obvious intelligence. This was a man who was able to inspire an entire generation (of not just Americans, but Canadians, Europeans, and Asians) to go out into the world and explore its boundaries, and to try and go beyond them for the betterment of mankind in the name of science and exploration, all with a residual effect that continues to echo to this day. This man, who pretty much single handedly prevented complete global annihilation, was able to rally engineers, technician, laborers to work together and accomplish something, that only ten years before, seemed not only impossible but implausible; all the while getting the public to support his mission.

However, I’m not going to start bashing your current President by trying to compare him to the (arguably) greatest American president in recent history. Instead, I take this opportunity to remind you of how a leader should act and present himself as an example and inspiration to his people by being honest (of course that is relative), compassionate, attentive, strong enough to stand by convictions, but intelligent enough to recognize (and acknowledge) his and others mistakes.

In the next year you will be bombarded with political messages telling you about how the one guy wasted your money on this, and how the other guy wants to waste all your money on that, and he wants to let all those killers out of jail. I’m not going to tell you whose right or wrong because honestly I don’t know…Dems, Repps, they all have an agenda, be it personal or professional. But as Americans you have a responsibility to yourselves and the rest of the world, let’s face it, they don’t call you a Superpower because you can shoot laser beams out of your ass. You are a nation of wealth and power and as a Canadian I fully acknowledge that as fact. But in recent years there seems to have been an abuse of both the things in which you have in abundance and now you are left in limbo where a great nation is divided and the effects are being felt worldwide. Loss of life and cost of war not withstanding, your people need inspiration, a cause, a rallying point to unite your nation and in repercussion the rest of the world… (motherfucking Star Trek and shit). In order to return to greatness a great leader must emerge and be chosen by the people…I just don’t know who that person is.

What I do know is that they should have a lot more in common with Kennedy than with Bush.

Peace out bitches!

Flame on freshness lovers! Flame on!

Oh, but we can.... we can.

Very inspiring.... now if someone will run who's worth a damn...

Calling Kennedy our greatest president is a bit of a stretch.

Visionary? Yes.

He did win a showdown with the Russians on the Cuban missile crisis.

Now, on to the bad. While troops were going to Vietnam during Eisenhower's presidency, Kennedy truly set the tone for the Vietnam war. The difference was he didn't live long enough to have his reputation completely demolished by it. He cheated on his wife in office. He was a drug addict. History has just been very kind to the man, but if he were president today, he'd be torn apart by a much different media. Remember, electronic media was brand new then, and there was still a lot more censorship in the news, and newsmakers cared about the reputations of our politicians, unlike today.

A list of great presidents of the 20th century to me would include both Roosevelts and Reagan. Say what you will about Reagan, but his final standoff with the communist block brought the eventual downfall of Russian domination in eastern Europe. To me, that's a larger accomplishment than a 3 day standoff with Kruschev.

Still, your post makes some very valid points about the current state of affairs, and I can appreciate your perspective as an outsider looking in.

I thought the same thing as you Rat, about Kennedy being one of the greatest, but he does say one of the greatest in recent history. So depending on how far you want to say recent history is, he is probably one of the greatest in recent history. I myself would probably rate him 10-20th all time.

Pro US , Pro Industry , an actual adult candidate -

Duncan Hunter

Duncan Hunter aligns the closest with my views. The various "candidate calculators" found online match me at about 85% with his views. Next was Fred at around 70%. Too bad Hunter is too obscure and doesn't stand a chance in the primaries.

I'm leaning to Fred right now.

Despite the facts you listed about Kennedy’s flaws I believe what he accomplished by uniting the world for one event, by far outweighs his banging of the hottest chick ever (if she was hitting on you like she did to him in that birthday song, could you honestly have said no to her). He accomplished a feat that made history for mankind in the name of human exploration not for political conquest. As for the drugs; I believe he was a sick man with a lot of medical problems so as far as his addiction to pain killers…meh…could have been worse.

Vietnam, other than the fact that it made for some kick ass movies ideas and that a lot of soldiers where treated like shit when they came home I honestly don’t know enough about the situation to comment.

The Medias role can never be underestimated. Perception is the key, I will always perceive Kennedy as a peacemaker, explorer, and diplomat because that’s the only information that I was exposed to; but despite the government censorship of the details of his administration his message was clear…

” For the eyes of the world now look into space, to the moon and to the planets beyond, and we have vowed that we shall not see it governed by a hostile flag of conquest, but by a banner of freedom and peace. We have vowed that we shall not see space filled with weapons of mass destruction, but with instruments of knowledge and understanding. “

Who here can read or hear those words and not be inspired about what could be and not what is the direction we as a species are currently heading.

What Kennedy did was bring Americans together. The mistake most politicians are making today is to try and handle the world's problems in a hope to make a name for themself. I believe a better plan would be to elect a leader that places their focus on our country and the world can follow by our example.

Currently the only candidate that fits that description is -

Duncan Hunter = Vietnam Vet 173rd Airborne & 75th Army Rangers
His son = USMC 2 terms in Iraq (& not behind a desk)
Also committed to bringing industry back to US

If we are to continue being a great country we can't dependent on the rest of the world to be our industrial base... My 2 cents...

So? He was human. I don't care what a president does with his personal and family affairs as long as he leads the country well. Kennedy did that, most presidents since then haven't.

I'm just saying that if he did that today, think of what the character assault that would come from the media. Think Clinton, and he wouldn't be remembered as fondly as he is.

Context, Firth, CONTEXT!

Kennedy had his vices, but at the end of the day, his greatest gift was an uncanny ability to truly inspire people. When we visited Arlington National Cemetery, I got an opportunity to explain that to my daughters, who were teenagers then. They wanted to know why many of the older people were crying at the eternal flame where Kennedy is buried. Camelot and all that meant a lot to people at the time.

It's interesting though to read books and articles about Kennedy written before he was killed. The rose-colored glasses are nowhere to be found and the overall tone is far less admiring.

Most of our leaders today have no courage. It's all about spin and political correctness and how their message sells to the increasingly ignorant masses. I'd gladly forgive a few imperfections in return for a candidate I can support as opposed to voting for the lesser of the evils who happen to be running.

GWB has huge amounts of courage. As it turns out, most of the country is disagreeing with his approaches, but you gotta give the guy credit for having the balls to stand by his convictions without folding to political pressure.

Now...

If we had someone that had courage AND a common viewpoint with the majority of citizens, we'd be on to something.

Some may call it courage.

Others may call it stubborn.

They were on their way there during Truman's presidency.

(Except they were only called "advisors.")

Impossible considering the country is divided on just about every viewpoint. He has to pick one side and unfortunately for him, he picked the sides that the media was against.

Gee and to think JFK had to use Mob influence just to get elected.

To bad that same influence got he and his brother Bobby killed.

I don't recall anyone in the media being against going into Afghanistan.

He didn't pick (in your words) "the side that the media was against" at that point.

NuDan.....

It's always interesting when Canadians seem to have so-called opinions on American politics. It's even more interesting when your own country is going down the road of national suicide with much of it's domestic policies.

You have a country that currently has one of the world's leading economies, yet your country has almost no capability of defending itself. I don't think President Kennedy would approve of a Western country with a major economy who has less military capability than your average Middle Eastern dictatorship.

You throw around President Kennedy's name, but I seriously doubt that you know a single thing about him. All you know is the propaganda that you have been fed. But then again Canada is a country saturated by nothing but political propaganda. Much of it anti-American.

If John F. Kennedy were alive today, he would be appalled at the state of his former political party. JFK was a staunch anti-communist and a staunch anti-Marxist. He was a firm believer in the power of the free market. He was a firm believer in tax cuts and the lowering of taxation in order for people and business to be able to keep more of their own money.

If JFK were alive today and running for office with the exact same values he held as president, he would be thrown out of the Democrat Party on his ass. He would have zero support from any Democrat. That is the sad state of the modern Democrat Party today.

Sometimes Democrats here in America hold up JFK as some kind of hero. That is almost beyond unbelievable because the party itself does not share any of the values held by former President, JFK.

You people in modern day Canada for the most part hold political ideals that are the antithesis of the values held by JFK.

Why do you even start a thread mentioning JFK when he had nothing in common with you?

You can believe whatever you want NuDan. There is nothing "Nu" about the propaganda you are pushing here in this thread.

You are full of shit if you think you can use a Democrat American president like JFK as a propaganda tool for whatever bullshit you are trying to push.

I don't know why you would even mention "Star Trek" in the same post as JFK. "Star Trek" is fantasy TV show that is all about futuristic socialism and even directly quotes Marx at times. A better title for the show would have been "Socialists in Space". If you get your politics from "Star Trek", then you must have some issues. A lot of issues.

Another thing you obviously don't know is that former President Kennedy probably had more in common with the current president, George Bush, than he does with any current Democrat running for president.

JFK did not believe in socialism. On the power of the central government, he was probably better on the subject than even George Bush. He was certainly far better than most modern Canadians.

Wow Madman...you completley missed my and everyone elses point...again. Keep up the hate man. And don't try to be smart, I doesn't suit you.

Really. What point did I miss?

If you want to debate... then debate. Just don't avoid everything by claiming your opponents are hateful. To make matters worse, don't avoid debate by claiming your opponent isn't smart. You are doing nothing but... avoiding making a response to defend your own comments. Regardless of how ridiculous they may be.

You started this thread and now you are being challenged. Don't be a coward.

I got your point. That is why I replied as I did.

You are now choosing not to debate. That makes it more than obvious that your original reason for starting this thread was for your own political propaganda purposes... and not debate of any kind.

Is that what a thread titled "Political Opinion" means to a Canadian like you? Maybe you need to start a blog if you want to espouse your political opinions without being challenged.

Maybe you should give some thought to the threads which you start. That doesn't seem to be the case. It also doesn't seem that you create threads with any possible responses in mind.

If you don't want to debate your own threads, don't start any more threads. That is how a mature person would behave.

Wow again Madman, trying to twist my words into communist propaganda.

The point of my original post (The one you missed by the way) was about a great leader who had the skill and foresight to inspire and unify a great nation with nothing more than a few words, neatly arranged to convey a simple thought...go to the moon. A skill which Bush has failed to master. Yes, they do say that actions speak louder than words but when Kennedy’s words can inspire so much action and accomplishment how can you debate the value of his feats and his communication skills.

To me Kennedy was a great man simply because he was able to bring the whole world together as one community, for one event, in the name of science and peaceful exploration, plain and simple. If you don’t see a connection there to Star Trek then your mind is more twisted than you think mine is.

Attacking Canada’s military is not only a national insult but a personal one, so my response to that is this; fellow Canadians soldiers are fighting and dying in Afghanistan along side your American brethren. They are fighting against the terrorist that attacked your great country. Your failure to acknowledge their sacrifice and your insults to them are not only a slap in the face to all Canadians but all the people who have died to fight terror including your fellow Americans. Good job man! Like I said before keep up the hate! We as Canadians rely on our allies for protection and we know they will help us in a fix because we have good diplomatic relations with the people we trade product and resources with. But don’t let that fool you, our metropolises may be filled with bleeding heart pacifists, but there are plenty of weapons here and real people who are ready to defend the best place in the world to live. Like they say “don’t confuse our politeness for weakness” ‘cause will kindly kick your ass Madman, but then we’d buy you a beer afterwards.

Considering the amount of spending it would take for Canada to defend itself to the same level as the US, I think it's quite a clever decision on their part. Taking into account nobody has ever attacked Canada or would want to!

Canada have it made. If the Ruskies or China attacked them, the US would step in to prevent them from hopping the border into the US. Those are after all the only 2 realistic threats to Canada. They don't need a huge military - because the US has one.

I think Canada actually have this right, rather than it being a negative thing.

This statement right there serves to illustrate the difference between American society then, and society now. And even more specifically liberal thought vs conservative thought.

There is some irony in the fact that Kennedy would most likely be a republican nowadays if you went strictly on his political views. He would even recognize the democrats of today and would most likely mistake them for socialists.

Kennedy knew that government should be there to protect us from each other, not protect us from ourselves.

The more you expect government to do things for you, the more you give them the power to do things to you. I think the population knew this back then, unfortunately I don't think they do any more.

You are assuming his views would have not changed a bit. Not a good assumption to make. Plus you are ignoring his social views. RFK had the same views - but his changed considerably in only 5 years.

TR would have been a democrat by today's standards - or even possibly a green.