Ok, I just want to make sure I have this figured out before I make my purchase. The space for the TV is next to a door with a window. It has plantation shutters, but still.. that probably means I should do away with Plasma as their are even more windows next to the door. Also, I'm limited in height, 29 in. (maybe 30 in), and it will probably need to have a stand (based on design of the built-in). Unless I decide to raise the uppers up, but I'm not sure I'm willing to do that unless it's compeletely worth it. Obviously, I'd like to get the biggest size possible. My final requirements are that I'm probably going to have to buy it from Best Buy and keep it under $1500. I have zero percent interest for 3 years and I'd like to take advantage of that. That said, has anyone had experience with Westinghouse?

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8346685&type=product&id=1175902657231

However, I also like the idea of DLP because of it's life span of being able to just replace the bulb as oppose to if LCD or Plasma goes out, it's out. Then again, I don't see much of a DLP selection at Best Buy.

Anyway, I thought I'd toss this out to the XOC guru's and see what kind of feedback I can get. Here's my built-in where I'll be putting my new TV:

That looks like a newer model of the one I have (LVM-47w1). Mine has no HD tuner in it (monitor only), and was $300 more. I'm very happy with it. I have a home theater PC that tunes and records HD, so I don't need the tuner. The Westinghouse remote sucks ass. Hopefully they improved it, although I don't really have any need for it. Between my stereo remote and my HTPC remote, I never need to touch the TV. The picture is clear and bright, and has a good viewing angle. The black could be blacker, but it is an LCD. The monitor is fairly light compared to others, and was easy to mount on the wall with a flat-screen bracket. It is awesome for movies, with the lights turned out. It is not as bright as a plasma, but that is a tradeoff I'm ok with. The 1080p resolution and sharpness is outstanding.

You could get a DLP for cheaper, but I am not sure how well it would fit in that space. I would probably go with a plasma, but would choose a differnet model. I don't think a tv of that size will show any benefit from 1080p - I would go with a better quality 720 plasma.

Regarding blub replacement - with a DLP or RPLCD you will have to replace the blub every couple years depending on viewing habits. With LCD or Plasma, the TV should last at least 10 years (probably closer to 15-20 yrs) before it dies.

If you are worried about those plantation shutters, you could get some "room darkening" shades to pull down over the plantation shutters for when you're gonna watch TV. We got some nice ones for all our living room windows - they look and work great. I have a Rear Projection CRT, which of course is more sensitive to that kind of thing though.

You're correct in eliminating plasmas. You definitely want an LCD for that type of room if you're going with a flat panel. My LCD is right next to a sliding glass door, and I notice less glare than my old CRT tube I used to have there.

I've never had a westinghouse, but known some people who have been happy with theirs. I have an LG, and highly recommend those, but they're going to come in more expensive than the Westinghouses. They seem to look pretty decent, though, to me they looked the best in their price range.

There's a few reasons that I would say get the 1080p. At 47" you're probably right where you can start to see the difference. Second most 1080p sets use a frame buffer to make a 1080i image progressive, which is a nice feature in my experience. Finally, you'll not be kicking yourself down the road for saving a few bucks like you might with a 720p display.

For anything under 50", 1080p is a complete waste.

Marketing fluff. I sincerely doubt if on a 60" set if you did a blind test that anyone could really point out the difference between 1080p or 1080i or even 720p.

Resolution is a simple measurement of the number of dots. The more dots, the more point detail. Diagonal lines look smoother, but most of what you watch on TV is a picture.

Color Gamut and contrast ratio will affect your perceived overall image quality lots more than resolution by itself.

I would much rather have a 720p set that has a good contrast ratio and a wide color gamut then a 1080p set that has crappy contrast and mediocre gamut. If you didn't tell anyone the specs of the two sets, size for size the 720p set would look leaps and bounds better.

The best advice I ever received from AVS Forum was to get a set from a place with a liberal return policy - i.e. take back with no questions asked and no restocking fee. If you aren't going to be playing video games with lots of static displays and primarily watching movies, plasma is still a much better looking picture then LCD.

Cheaper sets have cheaper electronics. Vizio sets that Costo sells? 14 bit color. Much shallower color depth then the Sharp Aquios or Sony sets.

Bottom line, don't get hung up on resolution alone Pay attention to all the specs - but most importantly, test it out in your house.

People swore up and down rear projection CRT (seriously old school) was simply not watchable in a room with bright light. I have two stories of south facing windows that only have light filtering shades, not room darkening - and my CRT TV is just fine. It's not as nice as it is at night when it's dark, but it's definitely watchable - to me.

I have also had a DLP set in this room and it looked fine. SDX will have to chip in with the make and model if you are interested - I don't remember.

Take advice given in Internet forums with a grain of salt and be willing to try stuff. If I would have believed everything I read and people who offered their opinions (well intentioned as they were) me buying a CRT RPTV was a huge mistake. They couldn't have been more wrong. $800 for 56" - it makes a gorgeous picture that still has a higher contrast ratio then any other display technology. Wider color gamut then most as well too. For the money, I couldn't beat it.

Picture is highly subjective - don't get too wrapped up in specs and enjoy looking and watching sets until you find one you like.

EDIT: If I was buying today, I would be buying LED based DLP set. Much higher color gamut, and the LED's last practically forever. No expensive bulb changes. Also, no color wheel, greatly reducing the complexity of the set (and no rainbow effect, which I never saw anyway - some people see 'em, some people don't). LCD's filter light, DLP's reflect - DLP will almost always spank LCD for brightness. But again, you can get the picture too bright. That's also something you need to be aware of, stores crank the birghtness because we naturally gravitate towards the brightest set - don't fall for that trap. Also the store has much harsher room lighting then (I hope) your house. Again, it's imperative to evaluate in your home.

Watching the Redskins/Philly game right now, and the HD is just amazing....

You're right about everything except the difference between 1080i and 720p...huge difference in quality of the image when I switched my Comcast box from sending a 1080i to 720p signal (I'll give you two guesses as to which is a better picture).

Wow, very interesting stuff here that I did not know. Guess I'll research more. This is why I post here and not on those other sites like AVS. I can't believe everything they write compared to here with people that I can relate to. I can't even believe cnet anymore as it's more money driven.
But what size is your TV? Which quality was better? The 720p?

I guess I left out what I'll be using my TV for. I watch a lot of sports and play on my 360 a bunch as well. Did I mention I watch sports?

Ok, for the fact that you play 360 tells me that you might want the 1080p, just to feel like you're getting every bit of performance that the console is capable of...I would but that might be me.

Sports, meh, I think you'd be better off with a DLP for sports, but don't know about the space you have for a DLP set. The signals you'll be getting are going to be either 1080i or 720p from your cable/satellite provider so 1080p doesn't matter so much there (see above regardless).

My TV is a 42" Magnavox 1080p LCD (got the 1080p in a 42 because it was on sale via Costco and it was below what I was going to pay for a 37" 720p set). And the 720p signal is soooooooooooooooo much better than the 1080i...interlaced pictures drive me nuts, though I knew that prior as I work for an Audio Visual company and I see all sorts of cool shit on a daily basis, so you could say I got spoiled with progressive pictures.

Hmmm, what your saying seems to contradict what others above are saying. I thought you couldn't see a difference on screen sizes under 50", even if the output was from 1080P source (i.e. Xbox 360, HD movies, etc.).

It depends on your set. What size is it?

If you are using LCD, DLP or plasma, the pixels are a fixed size. If the native resolution of your set is 1080 and you were showing 720 then that's why it looked like crap (the i or p doesn't matter when it comes to the shape of the pixels).

Think of your display like a screen on your screen door. A 720 screen has holes in the screen that are one shape and size (grid pattern) and 1080 has different shaped holes, and a different grid pattern. If you lay one on the top of another, the holes don't all line up. That causes aritfacts and fuzziness.

It's why when you have an LCD monitor on your computer, you are advised to only run it at it's native resolution - otherwise it tends to look like crap - fuzzy and with artifacts.

This is why Standard Definition (480i) also looks like total crap on the above HD sets - the holes in the 480 "screen" don't line up with the holes in either the 720 or 1080 "screen". Ironically, the oldest technology, CRT, doesn't suffer from that issue because CRT's don't have fixed pixel sizes.

The problem of fixed sized pixels is why Microsoft invented TrueType (to line up text along pixel boundaries) and why fonts in Safari for Windows look softer (Apple ignores pixel boundaries to preserve the accuracy of how the font should look).

There is one upcoming technology that doesn't have this problem with fixed pixel size, [url= http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22laser+tv%22&btnG=Google+Search]Laser TV[/url], looks interesting. However, SED looked promising but got canned when they couldn't get the manufacturing costs to be competitive with LCD or Plasma. It wasn't the first time the superior technology didn't win - and probably won't be the last :p

It's highly subjective. For example, for some people pick up on the "rainbow effect" in DLP's all the time. I never saw it. I do see motion blur in LCD's slower than 12ms - and I have friends who don't see it.

Could it be becuase your cable box upconverts very poorly? If the original source is 720p (which most HD broadcasts are), you are using your cable box to upconvert to 1080i, and then your TV upconverts to 1080p.

Why not either leave the output at 720p, and let your TV then upconvert to 1080p - or set the cable box to output 1080p?

I dunno Doc... My "cheap" Vizio 42" HD PDP hasn't disappointed me one bit... It's almost 4 years old (bought from Costco on Jan. 2004) with no signs of burn-in, reduced levels of brightness, or dead pixels (knock on wood)... Although it only has a max input of 1080i (DVI & Component), it delivers stunning images from HD channels (specifically Discover HD, since they shoot in 1080 resolution)... The only two complaints I have is not getting the 50" version and not having any HDMI connections... Of course, four years ago, HDMI was in its infancy and DVI was the pure digital connection leader... Other than that, I have no problems buying another Vizio PDP in the future...

For Nismo, with the amount of space you have available, an LCD would be best... The link you gave, Nismo, has the LCD height at 31" (29" or so without the stand)... Isn't that going to be an issue based on your height requirements?

- Air B :rolleyes:

My cable box is outputting @ 720p. My only point was that a 1080i signal is shit no matter how you slice it, and regardless of the fact that LCDs, Plasmas, DLPs, etc...anything with a native HD resolution is incapable of displaying an interlaced image. One of the reasons HD looks so good is the fact that it's a progressive image and not an interlaced image.

In short, if your cable/sat box is outputting a 1080i signal your picture is going to look worse than if you cable/sat box is outputting a 720p signal.
The difference you're not going to notice in a screen size under 50" or 60" is the difference between 720p and 1080p. As I said, I got myself a 1080p set because it was a smokin' deal

1080i doesn't look like shit on my LCD. In fact, it's not interlaced. The LCD uses a framebuffer to make it progressive.

Looking at DiscoveryHD, the the 1080i signal looks better than if I have my cable box downconvert to 720p.

[/QUOTE]My cable box is outputting @ 720p. My only point was that a 1080i signal is shit no matter how you slice it, and regardless of the fact that LCDs, Plasmas, DLPs, etc...anything with a native HD resolution is incapable of displaying an interlaced image. One of the reasons HD looks so good is the fact that it's a progressive image and not an interlaced image.[/QUOTE]

The best looking broadcast on TV for me is DiscoveryHD - which is broadcast in 1080i. CBS, HD NET, and many other channels are also broadcast in 1080i.

If a 1080i source looks bad on your TV, then something is wrong.

I hate quoting myself and nevermind the fact that I work in the AV industry and I deal with HD all day every day, I must not know what I'm talking about.

Not sure what you mean(I don't work with HD all day, sorry). Do you mean that 1080i is not a native HD resolution, or that a 720p/1080p tv will not show a 1080i picture?

Ok, it's very simple. An LCD, Plasma, DLP, etc...TV cannot output an interlaced picture, it's not how they work. The will convert the image to a progressive picture because, they don't scan every other line every other screen refresh, they scan every line every refresh, make sense?

Thank you for the basic lesson, but I think most people already know that digital displays are fixed at either 720p or 1080p. I also think most people already know that whatever the source, the TV will up or downconvert to the TVs fixed resolution.

However, what I don't know is why you say 1080i is so much worse than 720p, especially when a lot of sources are broadcast in 1080i. So when you are sending a 720p signal from your cable box and watching a 1080i channel, you are first downconverting the source, and then upconverting it back to 1080p.

Either way, if you send out 720 or 1080 from your cable box, your TV will display 1080p.

Now that I think ya'll have that cleared up, I'm still confused about the picture. Is it noticable to see the differences between 1080P and 720P or 1080i on TV's smaller than 50" even if the output is from a 1080P source (i.e. Xbox 360, HD DVD or Blueray)?
Yeah, that's to the bottom of uppers though. I'm thinking it might not look too bad if it overlaps it by an inch or two since it will sit like 6" in front it. At least, that's what I'm hoping.

Feel free to come over and look at my Samsung 61" DLP looking fan-fucking-tastic with a 1080i Xbox 360 game playing.

This chart should help -

Excellent, thanks! I think I've found a good model to go look at:

Samsung HLT4675S 46" Slim 720p DLP HDTV

It's not listed on the Best Buy website, but I believe my local Best Buy carries them. Anyway, I came across Samsungs when I saw this deal today:

Samsung 50" DLP HDTV + Xbox 360 + Halo 3...ate = $1,084.96

After much research, Samsung seems to be the DLP leader right now. However, I just measured and the 31.8" height looks pretty bad in that space of mine. I think I'll stick to my 29" height limit and start looking at 46" TVs.

BTW, that link is good for anyone that either already has an Xbox 360 or wants to get one. If you have one and want the TV, just throw the 360 up on eBay. If you don't have a 360 but have the TV, throw the TV up on eBay... I bet the 360 comes close to free.

One word of caution on the Slim models from Samsung. They can have serious geometry issues. You can test them easily by viewing the onscreen menu. Look at the outside edges of the screen for any upward "bowing". Mine was over an inch of curvature.

Samsung tried to tune my new 61" and the tech finally said exchange it. Circuit City fucktards said nothing was wrong with it until I pointed it out.

Compared to my Xbox putting out an analog signal I'm sure it does.

I believe that was on the the 56" and up models. I think there may have even been a class action suit about it as well. There haven't been any reports of that happening on the 50" or 46" models (yet?).

Well, I bought the Samsung HLT4675S from Circuit City for $850. (got a 10% off coupon from eBay). Should be here tomorrow and I'll post pictures soon. Now, I just have to decide if I'm going to go back to cable or keep the Dish, but I'm not in any hurry. More happy that I'll be playing my 360 in HD.

Well, after I got the Samsung hooked up, I decided that I didn't like DLP at all in my room. Sooo... I decided to do some research on LCDs. I found a great price at Frys for the Toshiba 42HL67 (42") at $999, but it was listed everywhere else for over $1300. I took my Samsung back to Circuit City and asked them if they would pricematch Fry's price on the Toshiba. They said they wouldn't because it's a wholesaler. Whatever, so I went to Conn's and told them I'd walk out of there right now if they would pricematch the $999. They did and I haven't looked back since. I'm very happy with it. I don't even have HD yet and my standard digital looks much better than on my CRT. Of course, the 360 looks incredible as well. As you can see, I also bought me some Halo 3.

Congrats, and welcome (finally) to the HD world. CFB will be WAY better for you from here on out ('cept your team still blows :p )...