Came across this article on Yahoo this morning. Im sure there are lots of ethical issues with wasting an organ on a person who has a terminal non-currable disease that is easily preventable but maybe he was an older guy who got HIV from bad blood or whatever.....take it how you will

Tim

Lung Transplant for HIV Patient

Do you know any HIV positive people?

If the person can be expected to live a few years after the surgery then it's worth it, regardless of how they caught the disease. I know if it were me or a member of my family I would want that. If it's only going to extend life for a few months, then it's pointless in my opinion and the lungs should go to someone who can get the longevity out of em.

Thinking about this tho. In non-HIV patients who have transplant surgery it's the bodies Immune system that causes the rejection etc. And the horrendous medications they have to take. So someone with HIV an immune deficiency might actually take better to a transplant than a non-HIV candidate!!!

Turning this into a 'The US Health care System Sucks' argument. If a rich person wants a new set of lungs and is near death from HIV here - No problem. The poor without the $$$ or health insurance are the ones who get screwed. Health Care should not be about how wealthy you are.

So you want a system where political appointees decide who gets what healthcare and who does not.

You want a system where in order to take care of a few poor people, everyone will have to be stuck with low grade, crappy government healthcare.

That's basically what you are advocating.

Maybe we can have a system like England where you have to practically go blind before they even allocate funds to take care of vision problems. Maybe we all would be better off waiting six months or a year in "queues" for our number to come up for a life saving operation.

Government run healthcare sucks. We already have it in many forms in this country and where it exists, it sucks.

If healthcare is so great in England, why the hell did you leave?

Does your current "American style" healthcare suck? I don't think so.

You're just what this country needs in this day and age of massive immigration. You're another immigrant who comes here and tries to tell us that we should be doing things the way it is done back in whatever shithole you couldn't wait to leave.

Who the hell pissed in your cheerios this morning?

He comes out swinging hard huh? Very antagonistic.

How was I swinging hard? What did I say that wasn't true?

Everytime there is anything on this board related to healthcare, all we hear from Rinky is that the healthcare system in this country sucks. Then he proceeds to lie about the system in England.

I want to know how bad his healthcare situation is considering he now lives and works in this country.

Come on Madman.

What you said may have truth to it, but your delivery is a little rough when the guy just voiced his opinion.

How can you say that isn't antagonistic, hell it's borderline personal. So when he responds in kind, this topic will turn into a pure flamefest. He never mentioned politics. He never mentioned his country's healthcare compared to ours etc.

Oh well, I'll butt out now....

I can see where you would think my delivery here may have been rough.

But, it's not like we have never been over this topic before with Rinky.

Based on his previous comments on this topic, I stand by what I said.

I'd still like to know how "bad" his healthcare is here in the USA. He never explains his justification for always disparaging our system.

I'm willing to bet his healthcare coverage is excellent.

He also did put himself out there claiming he was "turning this into a discussion" about US healthcare. Most notably claiming it sucks. As he always claims.

His delivery isn't rough - it's just New York style. Similar to Chicago style, but with a more annoying accent. We should have military style health care here - Motrin and water to treat almost everything, no sick days - you go to the doctor and he tells you if you are sick. He calls your boss and tells him you are sick and should stay home. Your boss then gets to decide whether you come in or not, he takes the risk if you get worse by ignoring the doc's recommendation.

...and if you aren't pulling your load you get dubbed the Sick Bay Commando

HIV isn't the death sentence that it used to be. With treatment, someone with HIV will live a normal healthy life for many years without it ever developing into AIDS, which is what is bad news!

Anyone with such a negative view on it needs to either do some reading or get to know someone who has it so they can learn.

True true.. I guess my 3 year old is just softening my normally thick skin up a bit (wipes a tear from his eye, sniff)...

I remember those motrin days.... Don't miss em!

HeHe and if you hate your boss by him making you work its easy for you to get him relieved!!!!!

To answer the questions???

Yes I have known someone who is HIV Postive doesnt really bother me as I know that the disease is very hard to contract.

I feel that anyone who abuses their body ie....drinking too much, smoking too much, or doing needles or having sex with prostitues or other dangerous activities should not benefit from life saving surgery when there are so many others who have done nothing of the sort and are trying to cope with the cards that they have been dealt.

With that being said maybe the guy in the article contracted HIV from bad blood or some psycho stuck him with a needle then he deserves all the help and benefits others who have taken care of themselves have.

You reap what you sow in this life and should stand for the consequences of your actions.

Tim

Oh shit - I was missing out on some fun in here it seems. NY - You are a dick. You know nothing about the healthcare system in the UK, other than the bad shit you read online - Where pretty much all of your dumbass political opinions seem to come from.

No - it's not perfect in the UK. Yes patients are put on waiting lists for non-emergency operations. So my gran for example had to wait 3 years for a replacement knee. But at least she got the knee eventually, rather than hobbling around here for the rest of her life on a bad knee, because she can't afford to pay for the operation and Medisuck are only willing to partially foot the bill.

When my dad was 32 years old he had a heart attack, we were a low-middle class family, pretty much living month to month. The kind of family here who would be unlikely to have health insurance. So here we would have had a $200,000 bill or some pathetically huge bill, that would have sent my family into bankruptcy. You are saying that is right for that to happen NY. That a normal hard working lower middle class families should be thrown out on the street or suffer bankruptcy because hospitals here can basically charge whatever they hell they like?

You truly are a sad individual if you believe that the little / no healthcare that 25% of the population here get is a good thing.

Why not?

Healthcare, like everything else, costs money.

People who have money, therefore, can buy the healthcare. People who don't have money have to find a way to get by and do without - just like in every other aspect of their lives.

It's a cruel world and nothing's free...

Wow - can't believe people actually think like that in the modern world. I assume you have health insurance and are financially stable to think like that!

Because we aren't barbarians?

Socialized health care has problems, which madman will no doubt continue to hammer on. The current US system has a shit pot full of problems too. On balance I tend to think the current system here is probably better than a system such as the UK has, but only a complete dipshit would argue that one system or the other doesn't have a lot of problems.

The only dick here is you. I would also add jerkoff to the mix.

So, basically you are saying that your grandmother waiting 3 years for something she could have had done here immediately is somehow superior medical care. Good argument asshole.

No wonder your home country is so fucked up if what they produce is a lot of people like you.

I know plenty about the healthcare system in the UK and Ireland. One thing it does very well is kill people. Another thing it does very well is make people's illnesses get far worse.

I have several extended relatives who died because of that fucked up system you think is so great. The waiting lists you seem to think is just a minor inconvenience so everyone can have really shitty bottom feeding type healthcare. They were people who would still be alive today if they had lived in this country.

It also doesn't sound like you know a damn thing about the medical system in this country. You just enjoy being an immigrant jerkoff who likes to criticize this country. All the while enjoying the benefits of this country. You ran from the country you are claiming is so much better. Why? Go the fuck back. Some American would love to have the job you hold.

You never answered the question regarding your healthcare here in America. Why have you avoided that question? You claim healthcare here sucks. Then your healthcare must suck. Well... does it?

Does healthcare here suck, or are you just repeating all the socialist propaganda that passes your ears and eyes? Maybe you should contact Michael Moore. Both of you are liars.

Quote:

When my dad was 32 years old he had a heart attack, we were a low-middle class family, pretty much living month to month. The kind of family here who would be unlikely to have health insurance. So here we would have had a $200,000 bill or some pathetically huge bill, that would have sent my family into bankruptcy. You are saying that is right for that to happen NY. That a normal hard working lower middle class families should be thrown out on the street or suffer bankruptcy because hospitals here can basically charge whatever they hell they like?

In this country you would have been covered by a government program if your father was a poor low income worker who didn't have job related insurance.

Instead of trying to push governmental socialism, shouldn't you be trying to push for things that might prevent other people from becoming a low income family such as the one you claim to have come from?

Quote:

You truly are a sad individual if you believe that the little / no healthcare that 25% of the population here get is a good thing.

Stop your fucking lies. 25% of our population is not without medical coverage. You get that bullshit from whatever socialistic crap you read. Those people also include illegal immigrants in their numbers.

We already have programs that poor people are eligible for regarding healthcare. You choose to ignore that because you don't know a fucking thing about this country.

You're just an ingrate immigrant who feels happy complaining about this country. For some reason you feel this country should become the same as the shithole of which you left.

This country doesn't need people like you Rinky. Maybe some of these illegals would make better citizens than you. Many of them don't complain and disparage this country as much as you.

LOL - Don't hold back dude. Say what you feel.

I'm not complaining about my healthcare here in the US. I'm complaining about the healthcare system in general. Where lower class people get fucked and where hospitals can charge pathetic rip off prices to the uninsured / under insured.

After I make my wealth here in the US I probably will go back to England, when I can afford to live there. Not sure how my friends manage - At least they don't have to worry about the bill for getting treatment at a Dr / Dentist or a hospital in the event of an accident.

This country doesn't need law-abiding, tax paying immigrants eh! Nice. May as well just let all the illegals in who don't pay taxes or obey the laws - That would be a nice place for you citizens to live in!!!!

Was thinking about this some more on my drive home. So what you are really saying NY is that you are communist and that everyone should agree with the government and not have our own opinions about things. If I disagree with the way the US health care system is run, then I should be repressed and my freedom of speach taken away?

Is the US not based on freedom of speach and the right to maybe once and a while have our own opinions about such things as say - Sucky healthcare for the poor?

Ya know I thought you were Republican through and through, but you're sounding more and more like a communist the more you argue. Maybe it's you who should move to North Korea or somewhere where speach is repressed and the people are forced to act like Zombies and not have their own opinions. I think you'd be right at home! Although I think they might have a government paid healthcare system too, so you might have to just put up with that.

Yes and yes... but... think like
what, exactly?

I'm a backwards barbarian because I don't want to fork over 30% of my paycheck so that your grandma can have a new liver?

Screw that. I say get the government completely out of it, get rid of ALL health insurance, place reasonable caps on malpractice suits, and watch prices plummet to reasonable levels that we can all afford.

ETA - being the SO of a veterinarian, I've been amazed at the price differences between human medicine and animal medicine. She broke her foot a couple years ago and it cost her about $4000. The EXACT SAME procedure (basically X rays and a splint) on a dog would have been a couple hundred bucks at a vet clinic.

Yes, yes, YES!!!

Finally, someone gets it.

I too look forward to sidewalks made of chocolate, rain in the form of beer, magical pills that turn the numerous ugly fatties in America into supermodels, and a job that pays seven figures yet doesn't require any actual "work" on my part.

Hey, if you can dream so can I, right?

Try an MRI. When my dog had back problems, they mentioned if rest didn't fix it, they would want to do an MRI. Nearly the same price as if I was getting the MRI myself.

I'm sorry, but I don't feel that health care should be a given for everyone. If you want it free, join the military. We're short handed as it is. If you eliminate all the "poor people" who are not able to join through their own fault - either criminal past, drugs, or some other stupid act, what percentage of the population doesn't have health care? I'm more willing to bet that it comes down to laziness.