Ok, so I went to trade my 04 for an 05 and walked out of the dealer after reading the specs that show the 05 with 1" or more lower ground clearance than an 04. My 04 (XE V6 4x4 Utility, Power, World Championship, Sport Package, & factor towing option) was marketed to me by both the dealer (based on their training manuals) and the brochures the dealers give out as having a "minimum ground clearance 9.3"-10.3"" Problem is even with tires inflated to 42 psi (OEM specs say 35 psi, but where I live in the mountains the local Nissan dealer and tire dealers all recommend 42 or higher on the X) min ground clearance is 8 9/16" measured with a digital tape on pavement. I have an 04 XE with 16" rims/tires (17's are actually .1" shorter than 16's in overall height).

Since there was no "Off Road" or other ride-height modified X in 2004, where did they come up with the 10.3" minimum ground clearance? The XE with 16" rims should have the biggest clearance and yet it's almost 2" lower than advertised and I run my tires with 7psi more air pressure in them than Nissan specs (which should give me even more clearance than they claimed).

It looks like they figured out they were lying to customers and modified their advertisements for 05 to say 8.3" to 9.5". Based on my measurements of 05's those #'s appear to be correct.

The question is, have any of you actually measured your ground clearance at the bottom of the rear differential (a regional manager at Nissan USA told me that's where it's measured) and discovered anywhere near the ground clearance they advertise?

I've gotten song and dance about how 'Nissan has the right to change specs at any time without notification' from the regional manager for Nissan but I submit they never changed any specs and simply put incorrect information on the marketing material to make it more attractive to people shopping for OEM ground clearance. I escalated the issue to their exec response team on Monday. I'm still waiting for a call back but I'm assured it will be today.

I'd love to hear what any of you are finding with ground clearance on a 2004 XE 4x4 w/ 265/70R-16 tires inflated to at least Nissan's 35 psi recommend specs. Should Nissan be allowed to advertise one thing and sell another? Should we tolerate it? Is it even legal in the US to advertise one thing and deliver another (if you consider Federal False Advertising laws)?

Considering you're measuring a used vehicle, and expecting it to fall into the specs as they would be if it were brand new, I'd say your methodology is flawed.

For starters, your tires are smaller diameter than what they started out with.

Secondly, the suspension components (t-bars and rear leafs) will sag, over time. As much as a half inch to an inch is not uncommon, for ANY vehicle, not just the Xterra.

So just on those two things alone, you could be looking at having lost at least 1/2", but it could be as much as 1-1/2". If your particular X started out at the low end (9.3"), then you're only talking a total sag/loss of .675". I'd say you're well within the possibilities of sag over time.

Not to mention there's no way in hell that a digital measuring tape, or any measuring tape for that matter, is going to be able to read w/ accuracy down to the 1/16 of an inch, on pavement... A granule in asphalt can be as much as 1/4" in diameter... Not to mention, a measuring tape stretches and contracts due to temperature. Ask a surveyor...there's a correction factor that has to be done, whenever you use a steel tape.

I think you have a non-complaint, here, and you're just looking at something to gripe about. Get over it, move on.

Ground clearance is a tricky thing. Toyota used to advertise that the Tacoma at about 12in!!! It's all on your measurments, tire pressure, tire size etc... As long as you dont hit any rocks than you have enough ground clearance!!!!

Tim

That's fucked up. Go with Nissan on this one, not the Dealer.

And published ground clearence numbers are next to meaningless.

Ground clearance is unsprung weight and my tires are brand new (Bridgestone Dueler A/T Revo's with the same exact overall diameter as the General Grabber's that came on it). Even if they were bald slick there's still not 2" of difference between OEM specs and reality. Perhaps 11/32" or so max.

As for a steel tape, sure there's a SMALL bit of variance, but NOT almost 2".

I also couldn't care less how Toyota advertises their trucks, I don't own one, but Nissan has "fixed" their ads for 2005 obviously after they figured out they were lying to customers in 2004. Car makers should not be allowed to lie. Computer makers got sued and lost in a class action suit a while back for claiming 15" & 17" monitors were 15 & 17 repsectively when they were in fact far less. Car makers can't be allowed to lie on this or they will lie on something else. HP for example, would be an easy place to lie in an ad? After all, how many people do you know have access to a dyno?

Nope, Nissan is publishing PSI for generic areas, not mountains where there are few if any straight roads. PSI is all about ride comfort and tire life not control & performance (no I'm not looking to drive my X like my MINI). Nissan's and all maker's specs are general rules, not necessarily right nor do the take into account when I pull a trailer. If I ran my tires here at 35 I'd get less life out of them and the side bars of the trad would be ruined long before the rest would be and I keep it aligned.

Tire inflation has a very big impact on control and performance, as well as ride comfort and treadwear - all 4 are impacted. 42 is too damn high for a vehicle like an Xterra, corners or not, and your performance (and likely tread life) will suffer accordingly.

If you're ok with that, more power to you. :rolleyes:

Edit - you need to get laid. Nissan probably didn't even use the rear diff for the lowest point in its earlier ground clearance numbers. Since there is no industry standard or government requirement that they do so, who cares? This is certainly not something that should get your panties in a bunch.

Listen. I can garauntee you that published ground clearance measurements are NOT taken on a 1 year old vehicle. I already explained to you how you could easily sag a half inch to an inch and a half, based on a year's worth of wear and tear. If you don't believe that, you're more than welcome to your opinion. But don't measure a used vehicle, and think it's suspension is going to be sitting at the exact same height as a brand new one. It's not. Springs wear. And when they do, they sag. Plain and simple.

I think he's focusing on the clearance at the rear diff, which won't be impacted at all by springs. The only thing that can affect ground clearance at the diff is the tires (wear and inflation).

But again, I doubt Nissan is using the rear diff as a measuring point for ground clearance.

That could be (rear diff measurement), but that's not where any manufacturer measures the clearance from.

It's like the horsepower comment earlier. Manufacturer's rate horsepower at the crank. Everybody knows this, and knows that that isn't the power to the wheels. No measurement means anything, unless you know what it's relative to...

Also, the claim that Nissan "wised up", and changed the numbers for '05 is crazy. It's a brand new vehicle!!! Different axles, different drivetrain, different frame, different EVERYTHING!!! Nissan didn't all-the-sudden decide to downgrade their clearance estimates, they've simply taken a measurement of the NEW Xterra, and posted their measurement of the '05 for the '05... Of course it's different than the '04 measurement. IT'S A BRAND NEW VEHICLE!!!

Well then when I take the measurement of a BRAND NEW 2004 still sitting on the lot the clearance should be the same as the advertise then.

Nissan has told me they measured at the differential for ground clearance and of course they wised up, the 05's are almost exactly what they claim but the 04's are off by almost 2". I can't believe you guys would defend this practice. Yes, I love my X. It's been a fantastic vehicle never failing me when I needed it most, but the fact is the marketing dept at Nissan lied to us or they were lied to by development and we, those of us who paid $25k+ for their vehicles, shouldn't tolerate it. Would I have bought the X with 8.5" of ground clearance? Most likely, though I was trading a '99 Outback and would have considered an 05 Outback that has similar clearances more seriously (given it gets 75% better mileage at $2.10/gallon that makes a difference too). I just want told the truth and Truth in Advertising Laws say they're wrong.

Anyway, Nissan has taken a very long time to research this and gather information (it's already been 3 days, 2 longer than I was told to expect). When I asked today why their exec team hadn't called me back they told me they were still gathering information and researching my claims. If they felt they were right I believe they'd have already called. One can't help but wonder if they discovered I was right and are trying to figure out how that is. I guess time will tell...

Forgot to point out that you're totally wrong here. You've missed the point that rear axle is PURE UNSPRUNG weight and had absolutely nothing at all to do with springs, shocks, struts, or the moon. The ONLY thing that could cause it to be lower is worn and/or improperly inflated tires. The tires are new and they're inflated to 42 psi by 4 different guages. I'm not talking fender or wheel clearance here, I'm talking RAW clearance from the bottom of the rear diff to the ground. BTW, I've done this measurement on concrete too, not just pavement, so pebbles were not in play here either. The measurement with a digital tape measure (ok, I'll buy it might be off by 1/16 or so, but not 2") was no more than 1/16 different than on pavement and that could be due to the fact that on concrete it had 1/2 tank of gas and on pavement it had a full tank (and yes, gas affects this because the added ~63 pounds of gas (9 gallons * ~7 pounds/gallon) will cause the tires to depress slightly.

A dealership told you that the rear diff was the measuring point, not Nissan - that's a huge difference.

If you honestly think an Xterra has similar ground clearance as an Outback, I'm not sure I can in good conscience continue this conversation.

:rolleyes:

You want to know why Nissan's "exec team" hasn't called you back?

Link to a Nissan source that says the rear diff is where ground clearance is measured, or link to a government rule/regulation that requires such a measurement.

Thanks.

Edit - feel free to get back to me on the tire pressure discussion if you'd like.

There has been a controversy over how to measure clearance...some say it should be the lowest point under the truck, others use a formula, the bottom of the diff, the bottom of the frame, etc...

Most makers use what ever they want to, as its unregulated...and its apples and oranges to compare them...the '05's rear diff, and the '04's rear diff can be different sizes for example...

The bottom of the '05 is a lot flatter and tucked into the frame rails than the '04's...so, in a real world situation, the '05's ground clearance, as used to get over things w/o damage, is going to be better.