The lead balloon one was retarded. Tissue paper thin lead? I don't think that was the original intent of the saying.

Make that lead balloon's thickness the same mil as a regular balloon and see what happens...

Are you watching the plane episode right now? You "it won't ever fly" bitches definitely owe us smart people some beers...

I don't buy it. The conveyor wasn't matching the planes speed

He could be driving 50 MPH and the damned plane would take off...did you pay attention to the scale test with the real treadmill??? The put it on max speed and the plane ran right off the end of the treadmill...oy vey.

Gimme my beer.

Or the example with the RC car on the treadmill??? The wheels of a plane are not powered, they're free spinning for all intents and purposes. Fuck me..

There's no cure for stupid.

If it matched the speed then why did the plane roll along on the conveyor before taking off??

What part about the engine doesn't power the wheels do you not get? They illustrated it perfectly during the scale test and again with the RC car on the treadmill...

OMG dude, seriously? the treadmill could have been doing 100mp and the plane STILL would have "rolled along" on the belt and taken off.

I think what he is getting at is there is no physical way possible for a treadmill to match a planes forward speed. You cannot get it fast enough. Even though the resistance is very low in the wheels of that yellow plane they used a jetliners would be much higher. But I still think the possibility lies in the fact if I had unlimited power to power a treadmill and could say ramp it up to 10,000 miles per hour to match a planes 100 miles per hour take off speed (examples there not saying takeoff for a jetliner is 100mph) that my theory of the wheels blowing up or failing would keep the plane from taking off.

I am not debating nor have I ever debated the fact the plane would or could move.

Thats what I'm getting at. I have not debated on this before now as well. Nor did I see the whole episode. So I'm not going to debate about it now anyway. But you guys are way too emotional about this

I haven't watched the MB episode yet, so I don't know what they found out, but I've said this before (in the other thread).

The real answer to whether a plane on a conveyor belt can take off is "It depends".

Many commercial aircraft require an airspeed of about 120mph to take off. (Light aircraft such as a Cessna take off at lower speeds.) If a treadmill moves exactly opposite to the aircraft's acceleration, then the mere fact that the treadmill moves at all implies that the plane is also moving. As the plane accelerates on the treadmill, the wheels and tires will be rotating at TWICE the "treadmillspeed" of the aircraft. Assuming ZERO windspeed, then groundspeed (which is not the same as "treadmillspeed") equals airspeed. When the groundspeed (and airspeed) reach 120mph, the wheels and tires will be spinning at the "treadmillspeed" of 240mph.

Note that F1 cars (and the [url= http://"http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x157l2_bugatti-veyron-at-top-speed"]Bugatti Veyron[/url]) can drive that fast, and the biggest problem these cars have at high speeds isn't wheel/tire friction, it's air friction (aka "drag"). Therefore, certainly there is not enough rolling resistance in the tires against the treadmill surface to provide much (if any) hindrance to an aircraft's engine. Nor is there substantial friction in the wheel bearings, which likely can spin at even higher speeds.

However, I did a little googling to find out what the speed rating is for aircraft tires, and I discovered that most of them are NOT rated for twice the take-off speed of the aircraft they're designed to be mounted on. Most seem to be about 50%-80% higher than the take-off speed of the aircraft.

So, if an aircraft on a treadmill cannot achieve its take-off speed before a tire fails, it will most definitely NOT take off, and will instead look a lot like [url= http://"http://www.metacafe.com/watch/407616/richard_hammonds_crash/"]this dragster piloted by Richard Hammond[/url]. But if by chance the tire does not explode before the plane achieves take-off speed, then it will fly.

It's apples and oranges to compare cars and planes in this scenario. With a car, the engine drives the WHEELS which are attempting to drive the car forward against the treadmill. With a plane, the engine drives the AIR which in turn pulls (propeller) or pushes (jet engine) the plane through the air while the wheels are spinning freely against the conveyor belt, however fast it chooses to go.

Therefore, it doesn't matter one iota how fast the conveyor is spinning, accelerating, or slowing down... the wheels are not in "gear," they spin freely, so even though they might be spinning at a zillion rpm, the plane's forward momentum is still governed by the thrust of the engine.

Hell, a 747 has enough engine thrust to take off even if its wheels were to fall off...

Why is this so hard for people to get? It's like being at the drag strip and hearing the ignorant masses let out their "BOOOOs" when the jet car fails to do a "burnout." It CAN'T for the same reason that the treadmill is immaterial...

If a regular xterra and an xterra with a jet engine on its roof, each with slick tires, were sitting side by side on an infinite sheet of glare ice; the regular x would sit and spin while the jet x would shoot across the ice like a lightning bolt. Does that help?

A harrier & ospray can take off with zero air speed & zero ground speed.

So a plane can take off regardless of any treadmill matching its speed. Myth busted!!!

Now about this already

Y'all are "faking stoopid", aren't ya?

Tryin' to get someone to bite, and get another flamefest pushing 100 pages again.



(Must not bite . . . must not bite . . . must not bite . . . )

Hammond's dragster didn't have wings.

. . . goddammit all to hell, I bit.

Fuck.

How could you get caught up in this thread? Fool...

Let's not start this again. Fuck, it's been proven already.

Asked and answered.

I wish they would have measured take off distance to see if it was effected.

Funny

It would have been another way to prove that it didn't matter. The test was not for the distance to take off though. It just would have been nice if they did a measurement to see if there was any difference since the truck and the plane speed weren't the same throughout. Better yet, it would have been nice if they ran a second test dragging the tarp at a higher take off speed. I'm all about wanting to see all of the angles though no matter if I know I'm right or wrong.

It's a good thing planes don't get their forward thrust with their wheels.
Otherwise they'd all crash when they retract their landing gear.... :rolleyes:

Some people just have to prove they are as dumb as we think they are, don't they.

Never have I said the plane gets thrust from wheels. I said the tires would blow.

And while a 747 can produce enough thrust to take off with no wheels it would not happen.

And this is why the debate continues.